buttkicker gamer 2 and sim lab rig

hi all first post here, i just finished building my sim lab p1 black :) and was wondering whats the best way to fix it to my p1. is there a bracket or a 3d print design i can use as just got a 3d printer for crimbo.
 
I've literally just been pondering this myself having bought a P1 as my GT Ultimate had a mount already.

Are you planning on mounting it to frame or directly to the seat wasn't sure how much vibration you'd lose attaching it to the frame?
 
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gamer 2 is BY FAR the most powerful small cheapish shaker you can get. they are 2-3x as powerful as a Mini LFE(despite being near identical). so technically you can mount on 80-20 frame or the seat frame....Seat will obviously provide more vibes as less distance to travel.
 
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@sim cave uk
Metal component to clamp onto is the best option...
I think some have even bolted a rachet/socket to the metal frame and then clamped the BK onto that.
A cheap alternative worth trying is some of the rubber isolators on ebay that have their own M6 / M8 threads.

@Furnace Inferno
Recommend to anyone to put the extra into purchasing a

1x Buttkicker Advance
1x Inuke DSP 1000

This amp as stereo will be ready to power a second unit in future.
Search the forums here, lots of posts on these products and several members owning this combination.

The BK Advance is the same unit used in the Pearl Throne and this will deliver much better quality of tactile below 35Hz that the Mini & Gamer series cant deliver so well.

The Gamer unit using the installed bracket, seems to increase the felt output, compared to the Mini LFE or Mini Concert models. While I have not seen an in-depth study of this by anyone, yet several confirm such is the case. It appears the arm/bracket acts as a mechanical lever to increase the felt sensation the unit generates.

One point I would say is that from an immersion perspective, a units low-frequency performance is a more important contributing factor than wattage ratings or power output. While the entry level units are not bad, people shouldn't need excessive wattage with these smaller units if they install them to the seat/pedal platform/sections. They will work more efficiently, maintaining the tactile energy more reducing any escaping/wasted energy, if these sections are isolated from the main frame with common neoprene rubber isolators as well.

It seems none of the 8020 cockpit builders put much thought into tactile considerations, especially multichannel configurations. See on the forums a recent d.i.y build by @Ceolmor for some possible inspiration.
Here
 
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Not to be too blunt Rodney, but the Gamer 2 Beside a Mini LFE is Easily 2-3 times more tactile NO questions asked. We've discussed this, I mounted those Mini LFE's every which way from Sunday and despite there being 2 of them, they couldn't even remotely touch what a Single Gamer 2 could do.

The Gamer 2 Frame IS THE magic sauce.
 
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Not to be too blunt Rodney, but the Gamer 2 Beside a Mini LFE is Easily 2-3 times more tactile NO questions asked. We've discussed this, I mounted those Mini LFE's every which way from Sunday and despite there being 2 of them, they couldn't even remotely touch what a Single Gamer 2 could do.

The Gamer 2 Frame IS THE magic sauce.

It's fascinating, really it is........
Although I wish you had experience of feeling the bigger models to add more to this topic and have that perspective to compare with. Mechanical physics are at play here.

I don't doubt that the arm extension makes a difference in the felt energy but nobody has properly tried to evaluate this to fully understand what exactly is happening, or to what it is really doing regards individual frequencies. You, however, have a "Frankenstein" set using 4ohm Mini LFE within the Gamer cases.

So your experience of this while seeing an advantage to the standard Mini casing (via arm extension and not being questioned) is not fully representative to a typical Gamer unit running at 2ohms (Big difference regards wattage). Also, if the Gamer model uses the same internals as the Mini Concert (also 2ohm) those units are meant to be tuned for increased performance at @40Hz (musical instruments). Do factor this in for those seeking to buy a Gamer model.

Anyone can feel free to see the PDF manuals for the full-size "Concert" model to the full-size "LFE" models that makes reference to the different product lines and how they differ regards their frequency tuning.

What IS being qustioned!
Ive found on several instances, people get mixed up telling the difference between increased energy with "lower Hz" and a higher but static frequency with "increased amplitude".Yet they are very different things. Its perhaps like comparing "bass energy" to "volume level", to many peoples ears, the "louder speaker" is deemed to have more bass. This is because of the way our ears/brain relate (higher frequencies) to be louder. Yet this speaker may be producing more higher bass frequencies not actual greater bass bandwidth.

In tactile the stronger felt sensation (a mid bass frequency with increased energy/wattage) is not the same as a much lower (sub-harmonic frequency with greater bandwidth and deeper lower vibration). Yet some would say the 40Hz with high wattage feels the most powerful even uncomfortable its so strong. What I can assure you is if you have the ability to push 10Hz to high gain levels with a unit like a FullSize BK LFE, it is a MUCH different sensation. Its not unbearable, yet can shake things in a room several feet away as you feel the much greater bandwidth it is delivering.

I previously asked @HoiHman last year to investigate the "arm issue" further as he began adding 80/20 profile arms to his BK pedal tactile. Though he declined, so it is something if I had a Gamer unit I would investigate more, mainly from curiosity. Maybe one day someone will put some testing into it but still for me personally many questions remain unclarified..

Before everyone starts thinking of adding "arm extensions"
Can you answer any of these?
  • Why does Buttkicker not just sell all models with some form of arm extension?
  • What length of arm is ideal, 6", 9", 12"?
  • Who has tested such to report and determine what each does, what variations does it cause?
  • How is it affecting the output of the unit regards different frequencies?
  • Is it increasing some Hz but masking others?
  • Does the mechanical oscillation help prevent or increase potential piston pang?
My point here, is that more wattage/energy does not necessarily always mean better tactile detailing and immersion. Its even possible to have too much energy with specific frequencies whilst seeking to get more strength from others. This is commonly found with individual units operating characteristics. Each may produce peak energy with different frequencies. Yet 35-45Hz are typical.

As I personally (being a tactile nerd) query what and how it is altering the frequencies. Yet I very much doubt that a Gamer unit will outperform a BK Advance. Importantly the Gamer like the Mini LFE has widespread user issues/complaints regards "piston pang". You won't have the same limitation with the better feeling low Hz using the bigger units.

I expect this is why Buttkicker themselves who install into cinemas the "BK Advance" model.
Choosing that and not the "Gamer" model even with its arm extension. Nor do I expect with its smaller internal piston, it can produce a level of low energy tactile and detailing to the same performance.

Anyone looking to get serious about tactile, should consider the BK Advance over the entry-level models. While I am no audio expert by anymeans or claim to be such. I post this again for good reason, bass frequency bandwidth is not the same thing as wattage, gain or amplitude.

Take note at the "size" of the rectangles for lower, mid and high bass frequencies.
For Butkickers the size/weight of the piston is relevant to what each can produce sufficiently with the increasing bandwidth for each lower frequency....


* General representation of the best bass capabilities for each model
Using @ 130Hz as highest usable felt frequency (Blue)

The best bass using 10-40Hz (30Hz range)
Has greater bandwidth energy than the combined 40Hz-130Hz (90Hz range / 3 times as much) found with common units.

As an experiment to this:
Try your tactile at 70Hz with @1.5x the volume of 40Hz What feels more satisfying and better?

The magic sauce :)
From my perspective, is choosing the optimal unit for the users requirements and being able to tune its output character (control its peak Hz and boost others) via iNuke DSP to suit the desired, installation and preference of the user.

I've yet to find a person not impressed with the BK Advance & iNuke DSP 1000 combination.
 
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@sim cave uk
Metal component to clamp onto is the best option...
I think some have even bolted a rachet/socket to the metal frame and then clamped the BK onto that.
A cheap alternative worth trying is some of the rubber isolators on ebay that have their own M6 / M8 threads.

@Furnace Inferno
Recommend to anyone to put the extra into purchasing a

1x Buttkicker Advance
1x Inuke DSP 1000

This amp as stereo will be ready to power a second unit in future.
Search the forums here, lots of posts on these products and several members owning this combination.

The BK Advance is the same unit used in the Pearl Throne and this will deliver much better quality of tactile below 35Hz that the Mini & Gamer series cant deliver so well.

The Gamer unit using the installed bracket, seems to increase the felt output, compared to the Mini LFE or Mini Concert models. While I have not seen an in-depth study of this by anyone, yet several confirm such is the case. It appears the arm/bracket acts as a mechanical lever to increase the felt sensation the unit generates.

One point I would say is that from an immersion perspective, a units low-frequency performance is a more important contributing factor than wattage ratings or power output. While the entry level units are not bad, people shouldn't need excessive wattage with these smaller units if they install them to the seat/pedal platform/sections. They will work more efficiently, maintaining the tactile energy more reducing any escaping/wasted energy, if these sections are isolated from the main frame with common neoprene rubber isolators as well.

It seems none of the 8020 cockpit builders put much thought into tactile considerations, especially multichannel configurations. See on the forums a recent d.i.y build by @Ceolmor for some possible inspiration.
Here
If it's the same unit as a thumper then surely it's not worth £135 extra and the hassle of getting the cables?

Bare in mind the dsp possibilities don't interest me as I'm more than happy just setting it up in Simvibe and the vibrations I'm currently getting. I just need it to vibrate when I expect it to which is why I'll get one more for the pedals for when the front end needs it, 4 in chassis mode would be wasted on me, just too much going on at that point.
 
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If it's the same unit as a thumper then surely it's not worth £135 extra and the hassle of getting the cables?

Bare in mind the dsp possibilities don't interest me as I'm more than happy just setting it up in Simvibe and the vibrations I'm currently getting. I just need it to vibrate when I expect it to which is why I'll get one more for the pedals for when the front end needs it, 4 in chassis mode would be wasted on me, just too much going on at that point.

Choice is of course yours...
The question is, do you want an improved performance from a better amp and with beneficial control features also able to power 2 units? A choice that several with high end rigs already use.

Good progress has been made with creating/testing effects in SSW and with immersion bettering Simvibe's own effects.

These are releasing soon as under final tweaking. Also a configured iNuke DSP profile that according to several members testing, is working well on the higher end Buttkicker models and operating beyond using a standard amp. The user simply loads it and no hassle, no experience/understanding needed.

A lot of time and effort has been put into researching and testing these, pushing the boundaries of immersion but it's what some of us like to do.
 
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Choice is of course yours...
The question is, do you want an improved performance from a better amp and with beneficial control features also able to power 2 units? A choice that several with high end rigs already use.

Good progress has been made with creating/testing effects in SSW and with immersion bettering Simvibe's own effects.

These are releasing soon as under final tweaking. Also a configured iNuke DSP profile that according to several members testing, is working well on the higher end Buttkicker models and operating beyond using a standard amp. The user simply loads it and no hassle, no experience/understanding needed.

A lot of time and effort has been put into researching and testing these, pushing the boundaries of immersion but it's what some of us like to do.
I just want plug and play, rumbles are rumbles to my butt and I've not thought they were lacking particularly, what's more noticeable is the lack in my feet, the V3 vibration motors are completely useless when everything else is kicking off can't feel them at all.

The only thing that really interests me is the fact I could use one amp instead of two, how does clipping work on it, the gamer2 is limited to 90watts and the throne to 200w, the gamer2 amp seems to clip quite early but I don't suffer knocking noise when below that but I assume with more I would?

What cables are needed for inuke?

I still think it makes more sense to get the throne if you have a way to mount it and even if you don't drilling 4 holes into your seat vs. 1 for a cylinder is preferable plus to get inuke later would only cost £30 and I'd have the pearl amp for that slight extra.

@sim cave uk what seat did you get? I think R-seats buttkicker mount which attaches to their sidemounts could do the trick if you have the right width frame (430mm I think) but it's over £100 so not very cost effective!
 
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I just want plug and play, rumbles are rumbles to my butt and I've not thought they were lacking particularly, what's more noticeable is the lack in my feet, the V3 vibration motors are completely useless when everything else is kicking off can't feel them at all.

The only thing that really interests me is the fact I could use one amp instead of two, how does clipping work on it, the gamer2 is limited to 90watts and the throne to 200w, the gamer2 amp seems to clip quite early but I don't suffer knocking noise when below that but I assume with more I would?

What cables are needed for inuke?

I still think it makes more sense to get the throne if you have a way to mount it and even if you don't drilling 4 holes into your seat vs. 1 for a cylinder is preferable plus to get inuke later would only cost £30 and I'd have the pearl amp for that slight extra.

@sim cave uk what seat did you get? I think R-seats buttkicker mount which attaches to their sidemounts could do the trick if you have the right width frame (430mm I think) but it's over £100 so not very cost effective!

The advice is given only as that, its for you to determine what best suits yourself.

Tactile often falls into two camps of people.

Those who may seek the best performance/options for the money they wish to spend. Appreciating options that give better control and upgradability in future to grow or expand for the future.

The other is those, that seek simple off the shelf solutions that may indeed be easier to install and are not concerned about getting the very best performance or control. They are happy to settle with what a standard package offers.

There is a lot of stuff about tactile or the iNuke DSP amplifiers on these forums if your'e interested in searching and reading. One Example Here

If not the Pearl Throne is worth the extra over a Gamer for an improved low-end frequency immersion. R-Seat Cockpits used to sell/install these.

Recommend you give SSW a try when we release the effects that have been worked on for the past 6 months. It will greatly improve the immersion it offers and is worth comparing to Simvibe as an alternative.
 
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The advice is given only as that, its for you to determine what best suits yourself.

Tactile often falls into two camps of people.

Those who may seek the best performance/options for the money they wish to spend. Appreciating options that give better control and upgradability in future to grow or expand for the future.

The other is those, that seek simple off the shelf solutions that may indeed be easier to install and are not concerned about getting the very best performance or control. They are happy to settle with what a standard package offers.

There is a lot of stuff about tactile or the iNuke DSP amplifiers on these forums if your'e interested in searching and reading. One Example Here

If not the Pearl Throne is worth the extra over a Gamer for an improved low-end frequency immersion. R-Seat Cockpits used to sell/install these.

Recommend you give SSW a try when we release the effects that have been worked on for the past 6 months. It will greatly improve the immersion it offers and is worth comparing to Simvibe as an alternative.
My thinking is always not to going looking for issues if you don't have any, otherwise you end up spending more time and money on something you wouldn't otherwise of cared about, ignorance is bliss as they say and I've already spent over £3k because of VR making it obvious I'm missing things!!

I remember I once showed someone the blu-ray of Kung fu panda and then switched to DVD in a dual feed and they just looked at me and asked why I'd bought the same film twice :laugh:.

I did try SSW briefly but as I said in the other thread I found the stock settings awful and considered sending the BK back after trying it. Those suggested setups seem crazy 2 BK LFE's would be way too much vibration for me, damn! Honestly all I'm really missing is vibration at my feet and motion relative to my memories of the real thing.

Surely testing these things is nigh on impossible in terms of feel to the end user as the rig and floor will play the most significant role in end feedback? The NLR GT Ultimate rig I had for example was entirely built from boxed steel which I imagine is great for resonating the vibrations, when I had the RPM effect on the Accuforce it was strong enough to feel like it was also vibrating from my feet like a Buttkicker. I suspect the P1 will dampen it greatly in comparison which is why I'm thinking a bigger unit might be needed.
 
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It sounds like your current "quality" of tactile immersion, regards your own "tactile experiences" thus far are a bit, mmmm well like watching a movie from VHS on an interlaced CRT. :roflmao::O_o:

A nicely installed multichannel tactile rig can be an awesome addition to immersion.
Though, such needs good effects, well-performing hardware and also good calibration.
 
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Perhaps but those were simpler and cheaper times plus CRTs still had better black levels and uniformity than LCDs and the motion resolution without motion processing is what 200-350 lines which again is less :p.

Anyway getting a bit off-topic with my hate of LCD. I think I will get the cheaper Thumper first then motion and decide if the vibrations are lacking, I just don't want too much drowning out other feedback.
 
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Perhaps but those were simpler and cheaper times plus CRTs still had better black levels and uniformity than LCDs and the motion resolution without motion processing is what 200-350 lines which again is less :p.

Anyway getting a bit off-topic with my hate of LCD. I think I will get the cheaper Thumper first then motion and decide if the vibrations are lacking, I just don't want too much drowning out other feedback.

Wish you well

I think what your missing in this discussion and also in refernce to @Moxley6969.

My experience or advice would lead me to state that, if seeking the best tactile enjoyment and immersion. It is important to take into account the nature of different frequencies. How we can then apply specific Hz based on how they uniquely feel. Using these to represent specific roles/purposes in creating the various effects.

Tactile is not all about watts or the sheer output strength. It's more about having hardware that can deliver the widest range of Hz from the lowest of 10Hz or under to over 90Hz and if desired up to around 130Hz. Covering all these frequencies and being able to produce them with a suitable level of energy and detail.

The BK Advance is possibly, in general, the best all-around unit for this.
The only way to improve such is to have "Dual Role" using two units to cover all the frequencies to provide both the very rich low-end bass and greater mid/high range detailing.


Different models have variations in their operating characteristics and performances can vary quite a lot. Having some experience or understanding of this allows us to learn, adapt how to best tune a tactile unit to then output (via PEQ/DEQ etc found on the iNuke DSP).

An example of different characteristics, from my own testing with creating SSW effects.
Is that I can create an effect that may feel superb on the largest Buttkicker LFE & Advance with it using really low frequencies. It delivers such wonderfully, feels superb for the desired effect (Lateral G). A vibration that needs this level of frequency. Why, well as other frequencies just won't feel the same or as accurate. They don't present the effects desired gutsy, weighty, yet controlled vibration offering something that relates to a real sensation.

Yet when testing on a $549 Clark TST model it will barely do anything.
Simply because this model cannot output those frequencies with sufficient power. Yet it can deliver much richer detailing in engines and in particular above 60Hz. So indeed tactile units can be used for specific roles and purposes and this is evident in peoples rigs that have taken the advice and went that route.

When you have spent as much time with tactile these are things that become apparent.
People that will use only models like the Gamer/Mini or the vast range of $30-$100 type products are not going to be able to get the full dynamic range from below 30Hz or indeed the subharmonic based frequencies below 20Hz. It is these that can add a difference to how good the tactile sensation is.

This is not to say people cannot enjoy tactile on budget models, but until a user feels for themselves and compares then they will not really grasp why I try to encourage people to seek better hardware.

I don't care what specs list, prefer real-world testing and operation as what I base things on.
We all have perhaps different perspectives and levels in what we may find sufficient. :)
 
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So your experience of this while seeing an advantage to the standard Mini casing (via arm extension and not being questioned) is not fully representative to a typical Gamer unit running at 2ohms (Big difference regards wattage). Also, if the Gamer model uses the same internals as the Mini Concert (also 2ohm) those units are meant to be tuned for increased performance at @40Hz (musical instruments). Do factor this in for those seeking to buy a Gamer model.


loI have a standard gamer 2 on the stock amp fyi on top of the modded units.



Wish you well

I think what your missing in this discussion and also in refernce to @Moxley6969.

I aint missing anything :p. Mini LFE's in standard frames sucked donkey ballz, and the gamer 2 itself and the frames just flat out work. 2 days worth of trying different mounting position and screwing around proved that.... Of coarse there's mechanics at play here. Never said there wasn't.
And of corse a Full Size LFE can touch Frequencies the smaller units cant, Main problem is there's a very small percentage of racers willing to spend Similar if not More on their Tactile setup than their wheel/pedal setups. So its all relative, the guys who want to geek out on tactile will do so with aid from your posts.
 
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loI have a standard gamer 2 on the stock amp fyi on top of the modded units.


I aint missing anything :p. Mini LFE's in standard frames sucked donkey ballz, and the gamer 2 itself and the frames just flat out work. 2 days worth of trying different mounting position and screwing around proved that.... Of coarse there's mechanics at play here. Never said there wasn't.
And of corse a Full Size LFE can touch Frequencies the smaller units cant, Main problem is there's a very small percentage of racers willing to spend Similar if not More on their Tactile setup than their wheel/pedal setups. So its all relative, the guys who want to geek out on tactile will do so with aid from your posts.

Yes Nick, for "you" they did, however plenty of people have the Mini LFE working okay. So you cant just use your own experiences of them as what everyone else does or will experience. Nor will everyone feel disappointed with them, at the money they cost, they have some quirks sure but they do fine.

At one point so many were convinced that "Chassis Mode" using 4 units had to be the way to go.
I have helped people in various threads to consider all the factors and that buying just 2 higher performance units for seat/pedals like the BK Advance, combined with a single iNuke amp can outperform in immersion what 4 lesser models may deliver or 4x BK Gamer packages.

I even put this to the test with combinations of my own tactile. As such is the benefit and importance of tapping into the lower frequencies and having better control, with more composure. Also such an investment can run reliable and bring years and years of enjoyment not just limited to racing sims.

What you may call a small percentage of users has been increasingly growing, even with the recent price hikes seen across Europe and UK. USA seems to remain with less changes to prices, regards BK units and on amps too. Yet even with the increases over here, I have encountered more and more people wanting to not just get "entry-level tactile" but query better alternatives.

Will "tactile" take pride of place or importance over a great wheel and pedals, errr nobody suggested it would or ever did. Why raise such as factor? However tactile from V3 or even D-Box doesn't come close to what is possible if someone wants a mid-range or hi-end tactile rig over possibly a cheap motion solution or to add to their motion they previously invested in.

Tactile continues to flourish and brings great life and addition to the immersion....
How many that have it would now race without it?
 
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Wish you well

I think what your missing in this discussion and also in refernce to @Moxley6969.

My experience or advice would lead me to state that, if seeking the best tactile enjoyment and immersion. It is important to take into account the nature of different frequencies. How we can then apply specific Hz based on how they uniquely feel. Using these to represent specific roles/purposes in creating the various effects.

Tactile is not all about watts or the sheer output strength. It's more about having hardware that can deliver the widest range of Hz from the lowest of 10Hz or under to over 90Hz and if desired up to around 130Hz. Covering all these frequencies and being able to produce them with a suitable level of energy and detail.

The BK Advance is possibly, in general, the best all-around unit for this.
The only way to improve such is to have "Dual Role" using two units to cover all the frequencies to provide both the very rich low-end bass and greater mid/high range detailing.


Different models have variations in their operating characteristics and performances can vary quite a lot. Having some experience or understanding of this allows us to learn, adapt how to best tune a tactile unit to then output (via PEQ/DEQ etc found on the iNuke DSP).

An example of different characteristics, from my own testing with creating SSW effects.
Is that I can create an effect that may feel superb on the largest Buttkicker LFE & Advance with it using really low frequencies. It delivers such wonderfully, feels superb for the desired effect (Lateral G). A vibration that needs this level of frequency. Why, well as other frequencies just won't feel the same or as accurate. They don't present the effects desired gutsy, weighty, yet controlled vibration offering something that relates to a real sensation.

Yet when testing on a $549 Clark TST model it will barely do anything.
Simply because this model cannot output those frequencies with sufficient power. Yet it can deliver much richer detailing in engines and in particular above 60Hz. So indeed tactile units can be used for specific roles and purposes and this is evident in peoples rigs that have taken the advice and went that route.

When you have spent as much time with tactile these are things that become apparent.
People that will use only models like the Gamer/Mini or the vast range of $30-$100 type products are not going to be able to get the full dynamic range from below 30Hz or indeed the subharmonic based frequencies below 20Hz. It is these that can add a difference to how good the tactile sensation is.

This is not to say people cannot enjoy tactile on budget models, but until a user feels for themselves and compares then they will not really grasp why I try to encourage people to seek better hardware.

I don't care what specs list, prefer real-world testing and operation as what I base things on.
We all have perhaps different perspectives and levels in what we may find sufficient. :)
Isn't the throne thumper the same unit as the Adavance with just different mounting and all in one package?

Much as I love your enthusiasm and dedication to better tactile I really don't want to get too invested in it because thinking about it too much for me lowers immersion even if it's better because then I start questioning everything.

Take picture quality on a screen for example I literally can't watch a film without critiquing the image quality, at the cinema the first thing I think is oh the blacks look grey and it takes me out of it straight away, even if I'm just appreciating the picture quality I'm still not as immersed in the actual film.

At the moment all I notice is a slight disconnect where the front end should get vibrations first and then move back but doesn't because obviously I haven't got a Buttkicker there. The upgrade to a bigger unit is simply because I want a bit more impact and suspect the extra rigidity of the sim-lab rig may dampen the BKG2 more than the NLR plus it's good to try better things to see if they are worth it and for £70 over the mini lfe ct sim kit it's definitely worth a crack.

I'm always a little sceptical though of reviews and other people's hands on after buying a Panasonic VT30 plasma because reviews claimed inky blacks and it was total bollocks to me. Compared to LCD sure but compared to my PZ81 plasma and the step down ST30 I thought the difference was minimal, blacks were still dark grey and I just returned them both and got a new bicycle instead and waited for true blacks.

I think it's easy to find big differences in things when you are heavily invested, interested in and have a lot of knowledge about them but in reality the differences aren't all that big sometimes, not to say that's the case here but I err on the side of caution. At least that way things still take you pleasantly by surprise rather than being a perpetual disappointment, I certainly enjoy things I try more now when I'm not expecting to be amazed.
 
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I recommend you ask people that own some of the higher-end models and are currently testing effects being created for SSW. They all have good rigs, some moved up from BK Mini and it would be better for anyone like yourself with doubts or concerns to get the opinion of more than one person like myself.

The source and quality of the effects being sent to the tactile is an important factor. That's whats got me excited again recently due to what we have discovered and can do with SSW in creating effect files. I dont know how good your settings may be in Simvibe or what effects you use or prefer.

Sim Lab Ridigity / Dampening Factor
The point of doing more direct installations in close proximity to the seat and pedals is to ensure you get the primary energy coming directly from the unit. Its a simple matter of directing the path the tactile has to or can travel. Using isolators helps maintain the energy in any platform or section. These two simple steps will improve the felt energy.

Seek the following for their own views if skeptical. All have experience with BK Advance / BK LFE.
@Signman @Magiashkii @DesKane @Ceolmor
 
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