AMS AI keep crashing into me again

[John Kerry]

Hi to all, I had the problem of the AI always rear ending me and driving like I'm not there a while ago and I was informed that with mods this is to be expected. Since then I have been driving mainly AMS stock content and now I am having the same issue. I tried the caterhams, MCR cars, Boxer cup and to a lesser extent Stock cars and it's as if they are not original mods. They only appear to be aware of me when I am alongside them.

Is anyone else having this issue? Have AMS in there last update done something? I would appreciate any advise and thank you.

 

[Marc Collins]

Hi to all, I had the problem of the AI always rear ending me and driving like I'm not there a while ago and I was informed that with mods this is to be expected. Since then I have been driving mainly AMS stock content and now I am having the same issue. I tried the caterhams, MCR cars, Boxer cup and to a lesser extent Stock cars and it's as if they are not original mods. They only appear to be aware of me when I am alongside them.

Is anyone else having this issue? Have AMS in there last update done something? I would appreciate any advise and thank you.

Will not happen with regularity with Reiza cars on Reiza tracks in the latest version of AMS, though the AI are far from perfect.

1. What version of AMS are you using?
2. What AI Strength %?
3. What AI Aggression setting?
4. Which car and track combination?

Even before you report back, the most likely cause is that you are too slow and/or erratic compared to the AI Strength % you have set. If you brake too early, turn too early or late, or do anything too far outside the realm of a proper racing line and behaviour, the AI will trip over you (or themselves).

Very simple indicator from the olden days that will save you a lot of hassle:

Drive your car/track combo alone until you can drive laps consistently within a few tenths/half a second of each other (assuming a normal 2 or 3 km track). Then, go to qualify and let the AI set laps without you on the track (you can use the accelerate time feature). Set the AI Strength % so the fastest AI is the same speed as your normal lap time. (And use Medium or Low Aggression, only moving it to High once you are comfortable and not being rear-ended).

Now go practice and qualify and like magic the AI will seem to have a new brain. The good news is that Reiza has painstakingly calibrated all their content, so when you find the appropriate Strength % that matches your skill, you will be able to use it for most cars and most tracks. Then, slowly bump it up 1% at a time as you are able to consistently beat the AI.

If this sounds like too much work, or not fun, welcome to sim racing...

 

[John Kerry]

Will not happen with regularity with Reiza cars on Reiza tracks in the latest version of AMS, though the AI are far from perfect.

1. What version of AMS are you using?
2. What AI Strength %?
3. What AI Aggression setting?
4. Which car and track combination?

Even before you report back, the most likely cause is that you are too slow and/or erratic compared to the AI Strength % you have set. If you brake too early, turn too early or late, or do anything too far outside the realm of a proper racing line and behaviour, the AI will trip over you (or themselves).

Very simple indicator from the olden days that will save you a lot of hassle:

Drive your car/track combo alone until you can drive laps consistently within a few tenths/half a second of each other (assuming a normal 2 or 3 km track). Then, go to qualify and let the AI set laps without you on the track (you can use the accelerate time feature). Set the AI Strength % so the fastest AI is the same speed as your normal lap time. (And use Medium or Low Aggression, only moving it to High once you are comfortable and not being rear-ended).

Now go practice and qualify and like magic the AI will seem to have a new brain. The good news is that Reiza has painstakingly calibrated all their content, so when you find the appropriate Strength % that matches your skill, you will be able to use it for most cars and most tracks. Then, slowly bump it up 1% at a time as you are able to consistently beat the AI.

If this sounds like too much work, or not fun, welcome to sim racing...

Hi Marc and thanks for your reply.
I have been driving AMS for some time and what you suggested is basically what I do. I just wondered if there has been some change due to an update and if so what I can do to fix it.
I am running V1.5.16r. I had this problem particularly at:
Bueos Aires No 12 boxer cup 83% difficulty and
MCR at Curitiba 90%.

 

[Marc Collins]

Hi Marc and thanks for your reply.
I have been driving AMS for some time and what you suggested is basically what I do. I just wondered if there has been some change due to an update and if so what I can do to fix it.
I am running V1.5.16r. I had this problem particularly at:
Bueos Aires No 12 boxer cup 83% difficulty and
MCR at Curitiba 90%.

No, you have the latest version, so should have all the latest AI improvements.

But, you didn't say what AI Aggression level you were using. Even a lower % Strength with Max Aggression tells the AI to always attack and brake at the latest possible point.

The only other suggestion I have is to pick the easiest car and the easiest track and start from there. MCR 2000 is pretty easy to drive, as is the Trainer. Le Mas du Clos (available here if you don't already have it) short version is probably the easiest track for braking points that is not a "kiddie" track and is still fun and challenging. Try Low or Medium Aggression and 90% Strength should still work there if it was good at Curitiba. Camaro is also good at Le Mas du Clos if you want a big heavy street car experience.

 

[gambolmaker]

Agreed. The AI agression setting is what makes them crash into you or not.

 

[John Kerry]

No, you have the latest version, so should have all the latest AI improvements.

But, you didn't say what AI Aggression level you were using. Even a lower % Strength with Max Aggression tells the AI to always attack and brake at the latest possible point.

The only other suggestion I have is to pick the easiest car and the easiest track and start from there. MCR 2000 is pretty easy to drive, as is the Trainer. Le Mas du Clos (available here if you don't already have it) short version is probably the easiest track for braking points that is not a "kiddie" track and is still fun and challenging. Try Low or Medium Aggression and 90% Strength should still work there if it was good at Curitiba. Camaro is also good at Le Mas du Clos if you want a big heavy street car experience.

Ok thanks Marc. I always use either low or medium aggression never high. Have you tried starting 4th at Curitiba and tried to get through the first corner without being hit from all sides. I will be very surprised if you did. I know I should expect it!!!

 

[Marc Collins]

Ok thanks Marc. I always use either low or medium aggression never high. Have you tried starting 4th at Curitiba and tried to get through the first corner without being hit from all sides. I will be very surprised if you did. I know I should expect it!!!

OK, I ran at test just for you. Not exaggerating, as I realized I didn't know how to start myself in a particular position--oh, there it is in the race set-up menu, but it says N/A? Oh, turn off Q (first time in the entire time I have used AMS I did this) and then I can set 4th I left the MCR2000 AI at 100% and Aggression at High (which is what I use at least 99% of the time).

Start the race in 4th!!!! Got punted off the track in turn 1 by the car in third (on my right). I stayed on the left and was following the second place car that was side by side with the leader. Damn, John might be right!

Then I thought about what happened and restarted the race. This time I made sure (with a better launch) that my nose was ahead of the third place car and that I squeezed just a bit going into first turn. Third place car yielded just enough to not bump me (it might have rubbed, but not enough to show up on the damage indicator), as it should. Race carried on in normal manner.

On the first race, in hindsight, I should never have tried to go around the outside of the third place car through what is effectively a chicane when I was already slightly behind it. My job was to yield, get behind it and take the proper line through the corner to set myself up better for the back straight. Or, in all the confusion, if that wasn't possible (very likely), I just needed to yield enough that I wasn't getting in the third place car's way as it naturally claimed the racing line through turn 1 and 2 (it was behind and not interfering with the first two place cars and I was technically behind it, so it had the expectation to do that).

I didn't run at lower aggression, but from what I can tell, the AI behave as expected through what is one of the toughest corners on any track in AMS (or real world racing). A huge straight followed by a double chicane that makes turn 1 at Monza look mild by comparison. Look how many incidents happen there with the top drivers in the world at the helm!

 

[John Kerry]

Thanks again for the effort. Are we running the same game?? Whenever I yield to avoid a collision I get bunted from behind and or swamped by cars to overtake me. That's why I thought it could have something to do with an update.
I even started a new profile which I thought helped initially but not now.
It's like you said I have to be within a very narrow variation of lap times to have no incidents. I thought the AI was supposed to avoid me not me them!!! I love AMS but I do find this frustrating.

 

[Marc Collins]

Honestly, just start with easy cars on easy tracks. There is a reason so few people in real life or online are "aliens." I am certainly not one, but after many, many years of practice I can hop in almost any car at any track and keep up with the AI at 100% within a lap or two of practice. But I used to be just like you, as did everyone else if they aren't still there.

The other sad reality is hardware. Even if you have the skills and experience, timing and executing a super difficult braking manoeuvre (which Curitiba lap 1, turn 1 certainly qualifies) requires high frame rates so as not to interfere with the foot-eye co-ordination of what you are seeing on the screen. It is also way easier if you have a high quality set of pedals, particularly with a load cell brake. My lap times and ability to brake magically improved with no effort from me as soon as I retired my trusty old Logi G pedal set and got a Fanatec CSP set.

Please run the MCR 2000 at 90% at Le Mas du Clos (it's your turn for a test). I will be shocked if you still get rear-ended after you can do consistent lap times on the short layout. Switch to the long layout with the incredibly tight switch-back and all bets are off. In fact, the switch-back is so tight even the AI have difficulty there. Once you are comfortable on easier tracks, try some medium ones. Save the world-class difficulty ones until you are ready. Same goes for cars. We can't jump in a 2018 F1 car and imagine we can run competitive lap times very easily even when we are spared ALL the g-forces.

Curitiba is a legendary track for a reason

 

[John Kerry]

Honestly, just start with easy cars on easy tracks. There is a reason so few people in real life or online are "aliens." I am certainly not one, but after many, many years of practice I can hop in almost any car at any track and keep up with the AI at 100% within a lap or two of practice. But I used to be just like you, as did everyone else if they aren't still there.

The other sad reality is hardware. Even if you have the skills and experience, timing and executing a super difficult braking manoeuvre (which Curitiba lap 1, turn 1 certainly qualifies) requires high frame rates so as not to interfere with the foot-eye co-ordination of what you are seeing on the screen. It is also way easier if you have a high quality set of pedals, particularly with a load cell brake. My lap times and ability to brake magically improved with no effort from me as soon as I retired my trusty old Logi G pedal set and got a Fanatec CSP set.

Please run the MCR 2000 at 90% at Le Mas du Clos (it's your turn for a test). I will be shocked if you still get rear-ended after you can do consistent lap times on the short layout. Switch to the long layout with the incredibly tight switch-back and all bets are off. In fact, the switch-back is so tight even the AI have difficulty there. Once you are comfortable on easier tracks, try some medium ones. Save the world-class difficulty ones until you are ready. Same goes for cars. We can't jump in a 2018 F1 car and imagine we can run competitive lap times very easily even when we are spared ALL the g-forces.

Curitiba is a legendary track for a reason

Again thanks heaps for the advice and test. Sorry it took so long to reply but I was trying your test.

I got Le Mas du Clos (great track by the way) and MCR cars and learnt the track and did a race at 80% AI difficulty and had no problems. Today I did a race at 82% AI difficulty and no problems again. I was still about a second faster sometimes so I moved up to 84% AI difficulty. Again I was on pole and again I had no problems, not at turn one or anywhere really. So you are right about this track so far, I still haven't worked my way to 90% AI difficulty yet.

I did not expect the track to make a difference to AI aggression!!! Anyway I really appreciate the replies and the advice.

 

[Marc Collins]

It's all just a matter of being able to master the track by yourself before mixing it up with others. You can read the woes of online racers for thousands of pages about this

Le Mas du Clos is a very fun and challenging track, but not in terms of hard or tricky braking points. Maybe others could help suggest the next track to try to master that has slightly more difficult braking, but not at the level of Curitiba? I might suggest Oulton Park Fosters layout if you have the Brit pack. Overall not an easy track at all and generally rated very highly by racers, but not so bad for brake zones. Another would be Queensland--any/all layouts.

Glad I could help and be brave--just start at 90%. Once you are familiar with the track enough to do decently consistent times, do Practice sessions with the AI and you will then be able to learn from watching and dicing with them about the tricky parts of the track. It will be fun and soon you will be able to work on heavy braking.

 

[Philip00]

Hi All,

Regarding this issue i was able to solve it to update HDV via pugrade file with the following:

UpgradeType="AI corner"
{
UpgradeLevel="On"
{
Description="AI corner"
HDV=[GENERAL]
HDV=AIPerfUsage=(0.90, 0.90, 0.98)
}
}

That makes AI use 0.90 value for Brake power and gip usage.

In F-Ultimate for me it solves the problem and works perfectly.

However with converted mods the AI behave differently (despite i put all the new lines which Reize implemented) and following my car too early.

In F-ultimate i do not have problem even when the aggrtession is high but in the converted mod with aggression level low and with the line in the HDV the AI just follow me too close and sometimes can't avoid to hit me becasue they are on my gearbox:

AIPassLatScalar=2.0 // Amount of extra space in meters left at 0 aggression when trying to pass. Default 2.0
AIStartOffset=3 //How long before merging at the start: min 0.5, max 10.0
AIStartMerge=10 //How long to merge at the start: min 3.0, max 20.0
AIMaxAggression=0.0
I have tried to modify the feelers and teh undertray lines in teh HD without luck.

Can somebody tell me what I have to change in order to an AI not follow me that closely but try to pass me or back off just like in F-Ultimate?

Thank you in advance

 

[John Kerry]

Hi All,

Regarding this issue i was able to solve it to update HDV via pugrade file with the following:

UpgradeType="AI corner"
{
UpgradeLevel="On"
{
Description="AI corner"
HDV=[GENERAL]
HDV=AIPerfUsage=(0.90, 0.90, 0.98)
}
}

That makes AI use 0.90 value for Brake power and gip usage.

In F-Ultimate for me it solves the problem and works perfectly.

However with converted mods the AI behave differently (despite i put all the new lines which Reize implemented) and following my car too early.

In F-ultimate i do not have problem even when the aggrtession is high but in the converted mod with aggression level low and with the line in the HDV the AI just follow me too close and sometimes can't avoid to hit me becasue they are on my gearbox:

AIPassLatScalar=2.0 // Amount of extra space in meters left at 0 aggression when trying to pass. Default 2.0
AIStartOffset=3 //How long before merging at the start: min 0.5, max 10.0
AIStartMerge=10 //How long to merge at the start: min 3.0, max 20.0
AIMaxAggression=0.0
I have tried to modify the feelers and teh undertray lines in teh HD without luck.

Can somebody tell me what I have to change in order to an AI not follow me that closely but try to pass me or back off just like in F-Ultimate?

Thank you in advance

Thank you Philip00.

Where do I find this file?

 

[viluglio]

The HDV files are the ones that define the parameters for the cars, i.e. the numbers that the game throws in all the physics equations. For stock content they are all hidden away, but you can still change particular settings by altering the xxx_upgrades.ini file in gamedata\vehicles\xxx, where xxx is the name of the car. Use the 1988/1991/1995 F1 performance files available in the download section as reference for syntax.

Having said that, it's a bit of a hassle to get right, and Marc Collins' solution is definitely better overall, especially since you're not de-calibrating the AI that Reiza has so carefully fine-tuned.

Edit: typo

 

[John Kerry]

The HDV files are the ones that define the parameters for the cars, i.e. the numbers that the game throws in all the physics equations. For stock content they are all hidden away, but you can still change particular settings by altering the xxx_updates.ini file in gamedata\vehicles\xxx, where xxx is the name of the car. Use the 1988/1991/1995 F1 performance files available in the download section as reference for syntax.

Having said that, it's a bit of a hassle to get right, and Marc Collins' solution is definitely better overall, especially since you're not de-calibrating the AI that Reiza has so carefully fine-tuned.

Thanks viluglio, I agree I don't understand enough to mess around with it.

 

[Philip00]

Hi All,

I would like to ask your help with the following issue: AI sometimes get too close to me and collides with me several times despite the aggression is on low..

On Reaize cotents i was abyl to solve this problem with changing the AI brake usage and grip values to 90. The AI behaves perfectly there.

However in the mods this trick won't solve the issues completely, I tried to add the follwoing lines:

AIPassLatScalar=2.0 // Amount of extra space in meters left at 0 aggression when trying to pass. Default 2.0
AIStartOffset=3 //How long before merging at the start: min 0.5, max 10.0
AIStartMerge=10 //How long to merge at the start: min 3.0, max 20.0
AIForcePassCarLength=0.6
AIMaxAggression=0.0
AISuddenMoveScalar=1.0

and I tried to modify the feelers and undertray value without luck. I have also tried to change Colltarget=False to Colltarget=True in the gen files without success.I have also tried to modify AIdraftstickiness andAIAimSpeedsPerWP value to AIAimSpeedsPerWP=(50.0, 105.0, 135.0, 165.0, 185.0, 235.0, 255.0, 275.0)

The AI just follows me too close and hit me.

Could somebody tell me what should I change in order for the AI behave like in the original content?


Thank you in Advance,

 

[Deleted member 247523]

.

 

[John Kerry]

modifying these values should solve your problem
BrakeTorqueAI =
AIPassLatScalar =
AIAimSpeedsPerWP =
AIMaxAggression =

Hi. Does this actually work? Have you solved the unsolvable???

 

[sonicviz]

Does anyone know the full parameter set for modifying AI via the upgrades.ini file?