GPU for AC in '24??

[Dethrone1427]

Evening all,

I'm looking at updating my system and getting 64gb of RAM, 14th gen i7 and either a AMD 7900XTX or a 4080. Obviously AC is a bit long in the tooth now so I'm well aware I'm rather over doing things but I wouldn't mind playing a spot of ACC too. Does anyone have any first hand knowledge of how stable a 7900XTX will be in AC/ACC. I wouldn't mind doing vr now and then too. I'm wary of team red due to horror stories of people complaining of driver instability...is that legit? Financially my head says 7900xtx but I've only ever been on team green so I'm a bit lost.

 

[Vintagedriver01]

Why not the AMD 7800X3D CPU ?

 

[Dethrone1427]

Why not the AMD 7800X3D CPU ?

I'm trying to upgrade for the next 4 years (that's how long the finance agreement I'll use to buy it will be). Also, this way if there is a system intensive game that comes out I've got enough horsepower to power it. I'm thinking if a developer chooses unreal 5 for example. I'm still using a 2060 and it really does struggle in ACC/DIRT and with AC with pp filters. I've had to revert back to default to claw back FPS. Are you using AMD?

 

[RasmusP]

Just gonna leave this here regarding CPU:
https://www.techspot.com/review/2783-ryzen-7800x3d-vs-core-i9-14900k/

A team mate in ACC has a 13900k and at stock he was seeing 143 W in hwinfo64 for the CPU while watching an ACC race replay at 150 fps.
I lifted my fps limit with the 7800X3D and had to set DLSS to the lowest quality to not be limited by my 3080.
Casually had close to 200 fps at only 63 W.

In AC, the 3D CPUs are massive too.
Another team mate with a 14600k asked me about his fps dropping into the 50's when sitting in the pits on the new LFM Nordschleife servers with 108 slots.
I wanted to look into it, downloaded the required mod cars, joined the server and got 110 fps.
Yes, I was CPU limited and the server settings were way over the top of what you should run, but the 7800X3D had no issues, lol.

(LFM changed it to 64 slots now)

About AMD vs nvidia graphics card:
There are reviews that show that for simracing and especially in VR, nvidia cards perform better than they do across all modern games.
So if you're seeing an AMD GPU being 5% better overall on reviews like Techspot, gamersnexus etc, then they might be 15% worse than the nvidia card for simracing, especially in VR.

Also, DLSS is just awesome in ACC.
When using AMD FSR, the telephone cables outside of the first chicane at Spa have gaps in them that are flickering.
When using DLSS at highest quality, you get the same fps boost as you do with FSR, but the cables are smoother than with TAA/KTAA!

Sadly dlss seems to have issues in VR, but on monitors, dlss is quite awesome right now.
And bonus: you can use DLDSR in ANY game to get the DLSS anti-aliasing.
So games without good anti aliasing, like all the games with DX11 that didn't have MSAA anymore but also no TAA yet, like older Assassin's Creed games or even Wreckfest today, look massively better.

I despise nvidia for how they treat customers and their pricing etc.
But I have to recommend nvidia for simracing.

If you're someone who doesn't care for jagged edges, shimmering armco etc, then AMD is fine.
The drivers are not causing issues for the 4 friends I have with AMD cards since years. They all had some of they'd cards: RX570, Vega56, 6650XT, 6800 and 7800XT

 

[Dethrone1427]

Just gonna leave this here regarding CPU:
https://www.techspot.com/review/2783-ryzen-7800x3d-vs-core-i9-14900k/

A team mate in ACC has a 13900k and at stock he was seeing 143 W in hwinfo64 for the CPU while watching an ACC race replay at 150 fps.
I lifted my fps limit with the 7800X3D and had to set DLSS to the lowest quality to not be limited by my 3080.
Casually had close to 200 fps at only 63 W.

In AC, the 3D CPUs are massive too.
Another team mate with a 14600k asked me about his fps dropping into the 50's when sitting in the pits on the new LFM Nordschleife servers with 108 slots.
I wanted to look into it, downloaded the required mod cars, joined the server and got 110 fps.
Yes, I was CPU limited and the server settings were way over the top of what you should run, but the 7800X3D had no issues, lol.

(LFM changed it to 64 slots now)

About AMD vs nvidia graphics card:
There are reviews that show that for simracing and especially in VR, nvidia cards perform better than they do across all modern games.
So if you're seeing an AMD GPU being 5% better overall on reviews like Techspot, gamersnexus etc, then they might be 15% worse than the nvidia card for simracing, especially in VR.

Also, DLSS is just awesome in ACC.
When using AMD FSR, the telephone cables outside of the first chicane at Spa have gaps in them that are flickering.
When using DLSS at highest quality, you get the same fps boost as you do with FSR, but the cables are smoother than with TAA/KTAA!

Sadly dlss seems to have issues in VR, but on monitors, dlss is quite awesome right now.
And bonus: you can use DLDSR in ANY game to get the DLSS anti-aliasing.
So games without good anti aliasing, like all the games with DX11 that didn't have MSAA anymore but also no TAA yet, like older Assassin's Creed games or even Wreckfest today, look massively better.

I despise nvidia for how they treat customers and their pricing etc.
But I have to recommend nvidia for simracing.

If you're someone who doesn't care for jagged edges, shimmering armco etc, then AMD is fine.
The drivers are not causing issues for the 4 friends I have with AMD cards since years. They all had some of they'd cards: RX570, Vega56, 6650XT, 6800 and 7800XT

Perfect! This was what I was after, you've helped me before with graphics cards and graphics settings so thank you very much once again! In regards to the CPU my preference is AMD but unfortunately my motherboard is Intel only. I remember the computer company telling me that when I bought it. So I'd have to invest in another motherboard too, plus I think I'm stuck with DDR 4 where my motherboard is quite aged now. Anyways, I'll go with the 4080 then - I also despise Nvidia's business model now. Maybe they are catering to folks who only upgrade now every 3/4 years like myself?? Who knows. I'll wait till the super models come out and then pull the trigger. Thanks again.

 

[Neilski]

In regards to the CPU my preference is AMD but unfortunately my motherboard is Intel only. I remember the computer company telling me that when I bought it. So I'd have to invest in another motherboard too, plus I think I'm stuck with DDR 4 where my motherboard is quite aged now.

What motherboard do you have? I may be confused, but I hadn't thought that any boards capable of using a 14th gen CPU would be old enough to make a CPU upgrade worth your while, unless of course you went with a really low-end unit within the range when you bought it (like the xx100 variant).

 

[RasmusP]

I'm a bit confused too...
For the 14th gen, you need a Z or B 6xx or 7xx mobo.
These mobos are compatible with Intel 12th, 13th & 14th gen CPUs.
What CPU do you have right now?

Oh and more than 16 GB RAM won't do anything for simracing. Do you need more RAM for other stuff?

About the 4080:
Here in Germany, comparing 4070/ti/4080, the fps per € are:

4070 (680€) to 4070 ti (880€):
122% fps, 130% costs

4070 ti to 4080 (1350€):
125% fps, 153% costs

And 4070 to 4080:
153% fps, 198% costs

So if prices for you have the same relative values, I'd recommend a 4070 ti instead. You'd save 470€ now. If you sell the 4070 ti for 350€ and a future GPU costs the same 880€, you'd only have to pay 60€ to get a new GPU, which will have more performance, higher efficiency and new features compared to the 4080.

Ofc that's only a good consideration if the 4070 ti would be sufficient right now.

 

[Johnr777]

I agree with everyone recommending the 7800X3D. Its a beast!

You can pair it nicely with a reasonably priced gigabyte b650 gaming x ax.... and DDR5 ram has come down a lot as well.

Cant comment on GPU, as im stuck with a 3070 (pandemic shortage issues)...

 

[Dethrone1427]

I'm a bit confused too...
For the 14th gen, you need a Z or B 6xx or 7xx mobo.
These mobos are compatible with Intel 12th, 13th & 14th gen CPUs.
What CPU do you have right now?

Oh and more than 16 GB RAM won't do anything for simracing. Do you need more RAM for other stuff?

About the 4080:
Here in Germany, comparing 4070/ti/4080, the fps per € are:

4070 (680€) to 4070 ti (880€):
122% fps, 130% costs

4070 ti to 4080 (1350€):
125% fps, 153% costs

And 4070 to 4080:
153% fps, 198% costs

So if prices for you have the same relative values, I'd recommend a 4070 ti instead. You'd save 470€ now. If you sell the 4070 ti for 350€ and a future GPU costs the same 880€, you'd only have to pay 60€ to get a new GPU, which will have more performance, higher efficiency and new features compared to the 4080.

Ofc that's only a good consideration if the 4070 ti would be sufficient right now.

Right, so in answer to your motherboard question....I don't know what it is! I'll check when I'm back by my computer, but I know I've got a 9th gen i5 k as I can overclock it. Sounds like I'll have to get a new mobo too. Balls... This sim racing lark is rather expensive.

 

[Dethrone1427]

So basically I just had a look at my local PC centre and this is what I came up with. The 7800X3D was quite a bit more expensive so I plumped for the model below. If that's a serious step down let me know, but would that be a pretty good shout for an upgrade in '24?

 

[RasmusP]

but I know I've got a 9th gen i5
[...]
Sounds like I'll have to get a new mobo too

Yep, sadly 9th gen mobos aren't compatible with any other generation
So like you said in the next post: go with AMD for gaming/simracing only.
Intels are only worth it if you're only playing one of the few games where Intel is better.
None of the simracing titles

The 7800X3D was quite a bit more expensive so I plumped for the model below. If that's a serious step down let me know

Yes it is. I've bought a 7600X during black Friday in 2022 and now a 7800X3D one year later.
I did quite a big comparison between the two. Here's the link to the posts in the Ryzen 7xxx thread, but in one glimpse:
The lower fps are about 2x higher in AC!!
Post in thread 'Ryzen AM5 ; 7000' https://www.racedepartment.com/threads/ryzen-am5-7000.250019/post-3728737

 

[Dethrone1427]

Yep, sadly 9th gen mobos aren't compatible with any other generation
So like you said in the next post: go with AMD for gaming/simracing only.
Intels are only worth it if you're only playing one of the few games where Intel is better.
None of the simracing titles

Yes it is. I've bought a 7600X during black Friday in 2022 and now a 7800X3D one year later.
I did quite a big comparison between the two. Here's the link to the posts in the Ryzen 7xxx thread, but in one glimpse:
The lower fps are about 2x higher in AC!!
Post in thread 'Ryzen AM5 ; 7000' https://www.racedepartment.com/threads/ryzen-am5-7000.250019/post-3728737

Yeah I'll definitely get the 7800X3D then, that's quite a lot more FPS right there. Thanks ever so much for the help and guidance!

 

[Johnr777]

Yeah I'll definitely get the 7800X3D then, that's quite a lot more FPS right there. Thanks ever so much for the help and guidance!

You’ll probably be fine with the PSU you got to power existing stuff, but also will need to budget for a decent cooler

 

[RasmusP]

that's quite a lot more FPS right there.

YEP! Here's a calculated table for AC with the difference between my 10600k at 60 fps (OC to 4.9 GHz) to my 7600X and a test with another forum member and his 5800X3D. Then added my 7800X3D, scaled from the results against my 7600X:

The 10600k has basically identical performance to the 9600k or 8700k. So you're looking forward to at least 2x your current fps regarding the CPU limit


About your parts:
Cooler should be fine if it's fine for your current 9th gen i5 k. I'm at around 50-65W in AC & ACC. My 10600k used 75W!

What PSU do you have? 550W should be enough, 650W on the very safe side.

Mobo: It's the one I have and I don't miss a thing
It has good VRMs, great RAM stability and one of the fastest boot times. It was tested by Hardwareunboxed (Techspot).
I don't see any reason to invest into PCI-E 5.0 yet. I didn't notice any difference when going from a SATA SSD to my WD black 850X nvme... And I don't copy Terabytes of data every day, so who cares for more GB/s for huge files.
Also a 4090 still performs almost within margin of error on PCI-E 3.0 and 4.0 is 2x the throughput, so you'd need 2x the performance of a 4090 to notice any limit at all without 5.0!
AMD also doesn't really have the USB endpoints issue with random issues when using too many USB devices, so I don't see a reason for an expensive board with lots of USB ports.
If you ever need more with a real extra controller, buy a 100€ extension card and done.


GPU:
I would recommend the ASUS TUF cards. I've heard, or rather not heard, a TUF 3070, 3080, & 4070ti and they are super quiet with great cooling for every part of the GPU and aren't really expensive in comparison.

RAM:
very very important: either get 6000 CL30 EXPO RAM oooorrr you buy Kingston 5600 CL36 (or above). Kingston only uses SK Hynix chips and they can be tuned insanely good.
My 5600 CL36 ran 6000 CL30 + tightened sub-timings without issues and currently run 6200 CL36 with massively tightened sub-timings.
With all other brands, you never know what you'll get from what I've read.

 

[Johnr777]

What PSU do you have? 550W should be enough, 650W on the very safe side.

Maybe a bit too low if he brings in a 4070ti, no?

Calculators are averaging 650W... I'd go 700W

 

[RasmusP]

Calculators are always way too high.
7800X3D won't go above 100W, 4070 ti won't go above 350W.
It's more like 70W + 250W.

And thanks to all the easy to access power limit settings (afterburner 2 clicks to limit, CPU easily limited in the BIOS), you could even just limit both parts for things like loading screens or restoring 200 browser tabs

650W is plenty enough, 550W should work, but could switch off when running benchmarks.
Quality PSUs have no issues with short peaks above their specs.
But yeah, I wouldn't recommend to buy a 500-600W psu with these parts. If you have one, it should work fine though.

 

[Storm Rider]

5800X3D and 3080 with a 34" wide display. 120hz at max settings.

 

[Dethrone1427]

Sorry guys, had a busy one yesterday. So I've got a 1000w supply. I know that because when I bought it the guy asked me what I would need it for (gaming) and he almost wouldn't sell it to me as he told me I'd never ever have to use that amount of power and it was pointless. I like to safe guard myself for the future