Noob question about braking

SWOT · Apr 4, 2015

Hi all, pretty new to the sim and my first one is AC. Recently just start doing some local driving in game when my G27 finally come. Taking the academy class with Bram is so much fun, but I have a question.

We were using the M3 E30 DTM, and for that car we can just floor the brake and it will just decelerate. After having a bit more confidence I start playing through the AC Career mode to get myself to play through the various tracks and cars, and for the first few they are fine. The slower FWD cars are nice and feels like my daily car, and the newer BMWs are quite nice too. However I start driving this KTM car and all of a sudden when I brake I see damages on the front tires. It was puzzling since the tire wear gauge shows 100% but yet the damage is there. I searched a bit and discover that it's something call flatspotting and that I need to learn how to brake at the threshold and not lock up the tires. I also learned that any car with ABS (incl the DTM) won't have this problem.

My questions is as follow. Since I'm using the G27 I feel like I don't have a good sense of when the brake are going to lock up. Is there any trick to this? coz it seems once it start to lock up release the brake won't help much until i release it for quite a lot. I end up braking way too early and way to soft to slow down (what Bram say "This is not racing this is driving to work"). I also tried changing the brake bias but somehow it just mess up the balance or something coz the car will spin quite easily under braking.

Now that I think about it, I think this flatspotting also happens when in the lotus 49 car... although I feel like it can take a lot more beating before the steering become bumpy...

JoelGL · Apr 4, 2015

Can you post your brake gamma settings in-game? I would also recommend the GTEye spring mod.

Ricoow · Apr 4, 2015

When applying brake pressure on non-ABS car your G27 will start rattling just before you lock up, on that moment you have to slowly release brakes.
When you lockup you should release a lot of pressure and instantly brake again, but a bit less hard so that you don't lock up. Be carefull because this will make your brake distance 10-20 meters longer.
If you feel you lockup too fast you should raise the brake gamma setting a bit, if you feel you lock up terribly late or the car doesnt brake well enough lower that setting. You can find it under controls in your settings.

Michael Carver · Apr 4, 2015

Depending on the car, one doesn't "floor"the pedal, the brakes need to be applied gently. Some cars may require the manual method of ABS, gentle pumping of the pedal. Try to do your heavy braking when the front wheels are straight. Make sure you are totally off the accelerator. Also you may find that setting the brake sensitivity in the Logitech profiler is a better solution than than the in-game gamma setting. I've found that going down to 5-10% sensitivity and a gamma of 1 greatly helps with cars with touchy brakes.

Launch the Logitech Profiler Software.
Click "Brake" on the lower left side.
Select "Axis Properties".
A window should come up that gives you options to adjust the sensitivity

JoelGL · Apr 4, 2015

Michael Carver said:
Depending on the car, one doesn't "floor"the pedal, the brakes need to be applied gently. Some cars may require the manual method of ABS, gentle pumping of the pedal. Try to do your heavy braking when the front wheels are straight. Make sure you are totally off the accelerator. Also you may find that setting the brake sensitivity in the Logitech profiler is a better solution than than the in-game gamma setting. I've found that going down to 5-10% sensitivity and a gamma of 1 greatly helps with cars with touchy brakes.

Launch the Logitech Profiler Software.
Click "Brake" on the lower left side.
Select "Axis Properties".
A window should come up that gives you options to adjust the sensitivity

Are you using a G27? If so, is there a way to adjust sensitivity of the clutch pedal (w/c I use for left-foot braking)? I'm asking because my Profiler doesn't allow it, though I'm using v5.10.127

Radu Oros · Apr 4, 2015

Joel Locsin said:
Are you using a G27? If so, is there a way to adjust sensitivity of the clutch pedal (w/c I use for left-foot braking)? I'm asking because my Profiler doesn't allow it, though I'm using v5.10.127

Not possible, only sensitivity for brake and gas. In AC controls menu you can change the clutch axis travel, try 49% or 50%.

JoelGL · Apr 4, 2015

Radu Oros said:
Not possible, only sensitivity for brake and gas. In AC controls menu you can change the clutch axis travel, try 49% or 50%.

Yeah, too bad. When you say 49% or 50%, you mean shorten the travel by 50%, so halfway press will be full braking (0-50%)? Or the reverse, start at 50%, to 100%? Thanks.

Radu Oros · Apr 4, 2015

Joel Locsin said:
Yeah, too bad. When you say 49% or 50%, you mean shorten the travel by 50%, so halfway press will be full braking (0-50%)? Or the reverse, start at 50%, to 100%? Thanks.

From 0 to 50% (or 49), out of 100, in the axis slider. I haven't tried myself, but you can experiment.

JoelGL · Apr 4, 2015

Radu Oros said:
From 0 to 50% (or 49), out of 100, in the axis slider. I haven't tried myself, but you can experiment.

I see, thanks. Yes, I could already imagine that would make it more sensitive, as it would reach full braking half-way travel. Wish there were a sensitivity settings.

SWOT · Apr 4, 2015

Joel Locsin said:
Can you post your brake gamma settings in-game? I would also recommend the GTEye spring mod.

I've tried two settings: Gamma 2.5 and Gamma 1. I've ordered the GTEYE mod and looking forward to it! I think the issue with me is probably more about not being able to feel where the threshold is, unlike my real car where I have the sense of distance from both my eyes (maybe oculus rift), the actual G force, and the fact that the G27 spring is not giving me enough "push back" to gauge where the threshold is...

Ricardo said:
When applying brake pressure on non-ABS car your G27 will start rattling just before you lock up, on that moment you have to slowly release brakes.
When you lockup you should release a lot of pressure and instantly brake again, but a bit less hard so that you don't lock up. Be carefull because this will make your brake distance 10-20 meters longer.
If you feel you lockup too fast you should raise the brake gamma setting a bit, if you feel you lock up terribly late or the car doesnt brake well enough lower that setting. You can find it under controls in your settings.

Ahhhh I see. I also notice the brief rattling but I guess I need to learn to smooth out my brake work a bit more to make that rattling more noticable.

Michael Carver said:
Depending on the car, one doesn't "floor"the pedal, the brakes need to be applied gently. Some cars may require the manual method of ABS, gentle pumping of the pedal. Try to do your heavy braking when the front wheels are straight. Make sure you are totally off the accelerator. Also you may find that setting the brake sensitivity in the Logitech profiler is a better solution than than the in-game gamma setting. I've found that going down to 5-10% sensitivity and a gamma of 1 greatly helps with cars with touchy brakes.

Launch the Logitech Profiler Software.
Click "Brake" on the lower left side.
Select "Axis Properties".
A window should come up that gives you options to adjust the sensitivity

That's interesting. What does the 90~95% sensitivity do? I think I understand what the in-game brake gamma is doing by applying an adjustment curve to the brake travel to brake power function, based on the clutch discussion I'm guessing setting it to 90% means that at 90% travel the game will take it as I've applied 100% brake force?? or was it the game will only apply 90% brake force even if i'm at 100% brake travel?

Thanks for all your advises! They are awesome.

Romano1 · Apr 4, 2015

I would suggest that you move the brake bias aftward, this will stop the constant locking of the front brake... Try mapping the brake bias adjustments to the buttons in front of your G27 shifter, that way you can fine tune the bias forward and backward while you are in the car.
Hope that helps

Michael Carver · Apr 5, 2015

I'm using G25, but when I select Clutch & Axis Properties in the Logitech Profiler I have the option slider for sensitivity for the clutch pedal as well. I use the clutch as clutch and have it set to 50%.

Joel Locsin said:
Are you using a G27? If so, is there a way to adjust sensitivity of the clutch pedal (w/c I use for left-foot braking)? I'm asking because my Profiler doesn't allow it, though I'm using v5.10.127

JoelGL · Apr 6, 2015

Michael Carver said:
I'm using G25, but when I select Clutch & Axis Properties in the Logitech Profiler I have the option slider for sensitivity for the clutch pedal as well. I use the clutch as clutch and have it set to 50%.

Yes, I'm thinking it's only in the G27 that clutch doesn't have adjustment for sensitivity.... Actually the clutch pedal doesn't even have an adjustment option, only steering, accelerator and brake appear in the lower left screen of profiler.

Kristian Maynes · Apr 7, 2015

I'm using 0% brake sensitivity on profiler and brake gama 1 on AC settings. I have a DIY nixim mod and it works great.

xnorb · Apr 7, 2015

I had huge problems with the XBow, actually made me quit the career mode at all.
Then i watched somebody on youTube driving it and was able to pick up how to drive this baby.
So i'd suggest: Watch others driving the car on youTube

What i've seen everybody touches the brakes only slightly in the XBow

SWOT · Apr 7, 2015

xnorb said:
So i'd suggest: Watch others driving the car on youTube

What i've seen everybody touches the brakes only slightly in the XBow

Indeed!! but now i'm too chicken at corner and end up cruising a lot...
(GTEYE Arrived, and it's awesome!)

Logan Griffall · Apr 7, 2015

I'm going to try some of these suggestions, I've been struggling with locking up the F40 at Spa.

Michael Carver · Apr 8, 2015

Also consider weight transfer..... If the front suspension is too soft, braking will transfer more weight to the front tires, helping them to lock up quicker.

MooresvilleKid · Apr 8, 2015

There is a lot of physics involved concerning braking. Different cars have their own dynamics when it comes to finding the right amount at the right time. I struggle with my G27 as im braking too soon and getting rear ended by more experienced drivers. Im afraid there is no answer to this other than tons of practice.