Regarding car set ups

[dave kirk]

This is in regard to all sims but I posted in AC as it seems to have the most people interacting, I am competent in racing/driving all the cars but my knowledge of setup is very weak, I would love to be able to change the handling characteristics of the cars but I never know what to do. My knowledge is limited to brake bias, tyre pressures and gear ratios.
My question is, is there somewhere that explains what to alter to get certain results, for example if I wanted better turn in, at the moment I'd just guess add front downforce, alter decel diff, stiffen front, but I really have no idea.

Any help or points in the right direction would be appreciated

 

[Deleted member 130869]

AC has very helpful text boxes that pop up if you keep your mouse pointer over the parameter, it's how I go on about modifying default sets. What you ask is covered there! Read the ARBs, camber and toe.

 

[Ernest Aubert]

If you can find the "Strategy Guide" booklet that came with Grand Prix Legends, you'll find a pretty extensive description of how setup changes affect car behavior.

 

[UMC 22]

You can buy it on Amazon apparently, here.

 

[AuldManGribble]

I found if you change the toe in angle towards a negative, it helps turn in.

 

[Turk]

Setups can be a bit of a dark art, but the most important part is probably knowing the car. You need to be pretty familiar with the way the car handles (by that I mean do a lot of laps, dozens and dozens of laps) so that you are able to actually tell the differences in any changes you make.

I don't think I do enough laps to really tackle setups, I do let the pressure down a notch or two and maybe increase the camber for twisty tracks but outside of that I wouldn't know if I'm making things better or worse. the other thing I'd go is gearing, that's straight forward enough when it's available.

The tool tips in AC give you all the advice you need, individually each setting makes logical sense but combining them turns into the dark art. I've been looking for a guide that would give you a best practice method for setting up a car. As in, it would say do this first, then do this, use tyre temperature to see if it's better or worse, go back and change this. But for me the bottom line is I don't have time to do the testing. I couldn't be arsed.

I have learned that for the most part the setup isn't the problem. You can make any car work if you try hard enough. Practice is core fundamental of driving. Everything else depends on it.

 

[m_mirk]

You can find some tips to cure under- / oversteer on the bottom of the pages:

https://driver61.com/uni/understeer/

https://driver61.com/uni/oversteer/

 

[Blimey]

everything literally has an explanation in the game.

 

[UMC 22]

everything literally has an explanation in the game.

The tooltips in-game are good, but very brief and give little info about how one setting can affect others. The more information you have on something, the more you can understand it and make informed decisions.

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

@dave kirk In my experience too much value is given to setups in general. Most drivers, yes a majority, are clueless when it comes to the handling of their cars so you aren't alone.

However the biggest mistake this group of drivers make imo is to start downloading setups of other people and think it will speed them up. Fact: it won't. Mastering a car with the default setup on track x and racing 100s of laps makes you faster and a better driver. When you reach the point that how many laps you race on track x the laptimes stay the same, then THAT is the moment to start reading up on setups and start your tweaking carreer

I highly recommend our ancient, but still very relevant free setup guide that you can download here http://www.racedepartment.com/threads/racedepartment-setup-guide.1085/

Good luck!

 

[dave kirk]

@dave kirk In my experience too much value is given to setups in general. Most drivers, yes a majority, are clueless when it comes to the handling of their cars so you aren't alone.

However the biggest mistake this group of drivers make imo is to start downloading setups of other people and think it will speed them up. Fact: it won't. Mastering a car with the default setup on track x and racing 100s of laps makes you faster and a better driver. When you reach the point that how many laps you race on track x the laptimes stay the same, then THAT is the moment to start reading up on setups and start your tweaking carreer

I highly recommend our ancient, but still very relevant free setup guide that you can download here http://www.racedepartment.com/threads/racedepartment-setup-guide.1085/

Good luck!

Thanks for the reply, and I agree somewhat, i think you should master the track/car combo before you start to work on setup, but setup can make a huge different, there are games where setup has been worth between 0.5 - 2.5 seconds, and that is huge, especially if racing online.
On single player I have never bothered but multi-player I think it's a must

 

[Stereo]

I'd do basic comfort setup things immediately - set the brake bias and gear ratios to suit the track, pick a set of tires that suits the role - softs for hotlapping, or harder for enduro practice. Or if the car's just too unstable to really push it, fix that. But fine tuning can wait until you're good at driving the car.

 

[Rob Nelson]

However the biggest mistake this group of drivers make imo is to start downloading setups of other people and think it will speed them up. Fact: it won't...

I agree with you for the most part. I have downloaded setups that made no difference over a single lap, but were very easy to drive. This allowed me to be faster over a race stint. Also, seeing what other people do with their setups can give you ideas that you may not have come up with otherwise.

 

[Deleted member 130869]

seeing what other people do with their setups can give you ideas that you may not have come up with otherwise.

Exactly this for me. I rarely use anything from anyone else, I have only used setups from packs like Greger Huttu or someone else's for GPL, and then see how the car handles different. Since back then, I do like to see if there are either exploits - it sucks when there are - or another aspect of a setup that I didn't know I could greatly alter from stock. Like going further into the lowest or highest numbers for certain parameters.

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

but setup can make a huge different

Racing for a lot of years now but I have never had 0.5 - 2.5 seconds progress based on a single setup, few tenths the most on a perfect lap max.

 

[UMC 22]

Usually setup does little for me since, as Bram said, I don't know the car/track well enough. I'm not a good enough driver to get near-perfect laps often enough to put a difference down to a change in setup. But then in F3's the other day my times had plateaued. I tried a setup someone else had posted and instantly knocked 1.5 seconds off of every lap thereafter, so it was definitely the setup that helped.

That said, I do 99.9% of my racing with the defaults.

 

[dave kirk]

Racing for a lot of years now but I have never had 0.5 - 2.5 seconds progress based on a single setup, few tenths the most on a perfect lap max.

Altering gear ratio alone can shave off a huge chunk of that alone, especially if the car maxes out with lots of straight left, eg in Spa, or if the ratio is set way too high etc.
I've played on numerous games where setup was worth a second easily.

 

[dave kirk]

Usually setup does little for me since, as Bram said, I don't know the car/track well enough. I'm not a good enough driver to get near-perfect laps often enough to put a difference down to a change in setup. But then in F3's the other day my times had plateaued. I tried a setup someone else had posted and instantly knocked 1.5 seconds off of every lap thereafter, so it was definitely the setup that helped.

That said, I do 99.9% of my racing with the defaults.

Yeah, I've had the same thing to, although I can lap consistently to 2 tenths once I learn a track, so I know for sure it is the setup that made all the difference. The only thing that concerns me about setups are the "cheats" I know that the F1 games were hardly sims but as a example there were some crazy setups in that game that made no sense but where between 1-2 seconds quicker than default.

 

[garyjpaterson]

Whilst I agree for the most part, setups are less important than the driving itself - I sometimes find a car (usually something vintage, though not always) that I just have no confidence in, and often some simple tweaking just allows me to drive without worrying about what the car is doing.

An example was the Jag XJ13 - was found myself all over the place under braking, so much so that's all I could concentrate on, was not shooting off the track under braking.

A bit of investigating led me realising the toe was all over the place, and was able to make it so I could brake without feeling unstable. Laptimes came down immediately.

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

Don't get me wrong, it's important to learn about setups to modify the car and make them more driveable and suitable for your own personal style. Absolutely agree.

I just disagree that a single setup will make you 0.5 to 2.5 seconds faster.

In the Driver Academy sessions here at RD new drivers sometimes progress up to 12 seconds on their previous best lap and that is without tweaking a single parameter of the setup. It's driving technique, track and car knowledge and repeat repeat repeat