Tools to suck less?

[gto28836]

So I'm brand new to sim racing - 20 hours in so far, all on AC - and I suuuuuck.

For example in the Lotus 2-Eleven at Imola I did a 2:08, vs. like 1:56 -1:58 on some leaderboards.

What are some tools to study where I can be faster? e.g., I'm not sure how to analyze telemetry and compare it to others'.

Admittedly I'm still learning the tracks but want to try to get more effective in my learning/progress overall. I try to race against opponents but if I set the AI beyond like 80%-82% they just walk away from me

(For what it's worth I'm using a wheel and pedals, with 'Pro' realism setting, and no setting changes on the cars' setups.)

 

[Stereo]

Watching replays is probably an easier way to start than telemetry. If you have the pedals app open it should show you what the driver is doing. You can use that on your own replays or other cars (ctrl+numpad 1 2 3 switches between vehicles)

As a starting point you will want to get the racing line right - on a single corner you're looking at entry, where you start to turn the wheel. apex. when you get closest to the inside of the curve. exit. when you straighten out the wheel again. As long as there's nothing in the way you'd want to use the whole track width; tires touching the outside edge on entry+exit, inside edge at the apex. Replays are a good way to check what you're actually doing and make sure you're hitting those points, then see where other drivers do it.

In terms of basic technique you want to be braking as hard as possible until you reach the entry, then do reduced or no braking towards the apex depending on the car, then as soon as there's space, apply throttle. One funny thing about AC's AI is their percentage pretty much only sets how fast they think a corner should be taken - they'll always apply 100% throttle at the earliest time to get onto the next straight, and brake as late as possible to get down to that speed. So you'll probably have a hard time matching their pedals performance... but you can work up to it.

 

[BrightCandle]

4 key areas.

1) Vision - you need to get your head up and 2 seconds ahead of where the car is. Looking at the apex while in the braking zone, at the exit while approaching apex. This takes practice, you need to spend time at 70-% of your capability to make room to change how you see but it will aid track discovery immensely so its the first thing to do.

Ensure you are using all the track by driving out onto the curbs and looking where the curbing is on your windshield as a reference, make sure you hear and feel it in the wheel and you are actually aware of the extent of the car, a lot of people get this wrong and don't ultimately use all the track as they have no good reference in the car. This way you can then start to use the full lines on the track, use some video of a good driver to find those lines and mimic them, but you wont be able to use their braking points.

2) Feel and the limit. The sooner you find a limit of the car the better, you need to go out into a skid pad and induce under and oversteer and take real note of what you hear, see and feel happen. What does the limit of grip feel like is important and what does exceeding it feel like in comparison as well as being below it. Once you have done this take it out onto the track and weave at 50mph or so down a straight introducing first a little then a increased pace of steering and just get a feel for pushing the car to that limit and how to get the car "set" on the suspension when you turn.

3) Braking you need to learn to trail the brakes. Hard on initial but come off softly. Mainly what you want to be doing here is finding the braking point before and then adjust your technique and assess if its now too early and if so move it a metre or two or be lighter on the braking phase. Just work on getting that hard on and gradual lift and a little 5-10% held and being gentle with the car. Look at how the car responds, how the front behaves as you do this and what the car feels like its doing in the steering.

4) All the prior steps will get you within 2-3 seconds of the genuinely quick guys. The last bit is all about the balance of the car usually in braking and you need to assess in mid and out of the corner how under or oversteering the car is and then what changes to make to your inputs to try and get the car neutral or slightly oversteer sliding.

 

[RasmusP]

Small 2 cents:
The AI can look absolutely crazy on the pedals sometimes so maybe it's better to watch some videos of fast people with their pedal inputs shown on screen than looking at the ai!

But you can definitely look at braking points and the lines of the AI to learn the track.

To get better efficiently, you need 2 things:
- know how to be fast it in theory
- learn to apply that theory while driving

So watching videos, replays of faster drivers, then comparing it to your own replays and analysing the differences is a good way.

Also I rarely read about people writing down notes while practicing.
I think it makes things a lot more efficient if your really write down what you'd have to do and then put the paper next to the monitor so you can read what to do next while on a straight.

 

[Interslice]

So I'm brand new to sim racing - 20 hours in so far, all on AC - and I suuuuuck.

For example in the Lotus 2-Eleven at Imola I did a 2:08, vs. like 1:56 -1:58 on some leaderboards.

What are some tools to study where I can be faster? e.g., I'm not sure how to analyze telemetry and compare it to others'.

Admittedly I'm still learning the tracks but want to try to get more effective in my learning/progress overall. I try to race against opponents but if I set the AI beyond like 80%-82% they just walk away from me

(For what it's worth I'm using a wheel and pedals, with 'Pro' realism setting, and no setting changes on the cars' setups.)

Hi, I made an Imola 'walk through' a while back. Hope it helps

 

[Tennisbiki]

What tools.. can help us improve?

There is no magic ingredient, of course. For me, it's being patient, put in the seat time, observe the car's response, your own driving, AI's driving, try different things.. find a good routine/practice.

My background is engineering and education, so I am all about learning. First thing to recognize is that everyone is different. We cannot all be Senna or Schumacher. So if you expect yourself to reach a certain pace/lap time at a particular time, the chances are you will be frustrated. What we can all do is .. we can all learn and improve. So adjust the expectation is important, I think. (Yes, I get frustrated too. But I am learning to be patient.)

The hard thing of course is finding another way to gauge your progress. Stop watch is one gauge. It is the truth ultimately, but .. Hot lapping, pounding lap after laps against the clock can be mentally tough and except for learning the course not terribly helpful. I would also like to know what is a good way of receiving FEEDBACK on driving.

Ultimately learning to be a good driver is kind of a black art, a bit like how to be good in martial art or a good fighter pilot. (Some may want to read BOYD: The Fighter Pilot Who changed the Art of War.) Specific skills can be described but how to achieve them illusive.

There is situation awareness, including vision/focusing, there is car control skill, there is setup skill, there is race craft including learning the track. And the intangibles.. red mist, feel/touch/smoothness, competitiveness.. self preservation or lack of?

Specifically.. perhaps focus on one area at a time. I typically start with finding a good line, meaning making clean laps (below limit perhaps) but consistently, then try exploit the limit of the track/car, hitting the reference points, apexes and track out points, lastly entry with higher entry speed/trail braking.

Try to have fun! That is the end goal, isn't it?

 

[armos22]

I'm not very good either, but I'll mention a couple things I didn't see said yet:

1) In the seat adjustments thingy (whatever it's called, the icon with the driver helmet) - Adjust your Field of View. The default is pretty wide, and this can distort your perception and make it harder to judge speed and distance. A more realistic FOV can improve your perception but it's a compromise unless you have triple monitors. You might need to pull it in to where you can't easily see the mirrors anymore.

2) I find that I have more fun if I drive something slower - especially if I'm still learning the track. Trying to drive a superfast car is a sure way to get frustrated. When I decided I wanted to learn Sebring, the first time I really had a productive session and enjoyed myself was with a stock-spec 1978 Ford Mustang-II (mod car). Then I graduated to moderately faster cars, but I still think I'd get frustrated if I tried to push any of the "hypercars" or pure race cars.
I like old cars and don't like driving aids so I went with the "malaise era" approach, but you could also just use modern cars that aren't very fast.

I'm sure it would be the same in real life. I don't think cost is the only reason that the Miata is such a popular track car. It's also a lot more forgiving than something that approaches corners at double the speed.

 

[BrightCandle]

2) I find that I have more fun if I drive something slower - especially if I'm still learning the track. Trying to drive a superfast car is a sure way to get frustrated. When I decided I wanted to learn Sebring, the first time I really had a productive session and enjoyed myself was with a stock-spec 1978 Ford Mustang-II (mod car). Then I graduated to moderately faster cars, but I still think I'd get frustrated if I tried to push any of the "hypercars" or pure race cars.
I like old cars and don't like driving aids so I went with the "malaise era" approach, but you could also just use modern cars that aren't very fast.

I'm sure it would be the same in real life. I don't think cost is the only reason that the Miata is such a popular track car. It's also a lot more forgiving than something that approaches corners at double the speed.

I really think this is quite important too. There is a lot of value starting in slower cars, GT4s and MX5s etc and its because they roll over slower and you have to ease them into the corners and you usually get a lot more time to assess what is happening and what you can do about it. There is a reason most drivers have to come through the feeder series in slower cars, its training to gradually build up their skills before they jump into quick cars. A lot of people make the mistake of starting at GT3s due to their popularity but these are ABS and TC equipped very stiff race cars and they don't give you the same margin of squishy to play with and see the impact of your inputs and feel what the car is doing or learn proper brake and throttle technique as you can just smash both with the right ABS/TC settings. I really got a lot better once I went back to slower cars and started to extract performance from them.