Understanding Car Setup

[JellyBeanz]

Hi all,

Recently registered here and due to join the race on Sunday eve at Brands Hatch
I've been SIM racing on/off for quite a few years (mainly iRacing) but decided to really throw myself into it this year. The area I've hardly ever touched is car setups so I'm currently trying to figure this out as I go.

So I found a setup PDF here in the members area I've been reading through which is helpful but the next step is trying to take this and understand what will help me and the car. I've played tons of spa in the last couple of weeks and found that adjusting the roll bars really helped my feeling of understeer in the 650s.

With Brands Hatch coming up I wondered if I could get some advice as to what and why I might need to look at?
I've found the car (650s) to be a little "understeery" for my liking so again a quick up of the front roll bar and it turns a little sharper but I'm now trying to asses the track and figure out what will help the car.

• Surface feels quite bumpy throughout (Soften the suspension?)
• Keeping up a relatively high speed throughout, especially in some corners (Increase rear wing?)
• Very few slow corners (Up the gear ratio, make it longer. In order to just ride some torque instead of too many gear changes upsetting the car?)

So that's my current assessment and I know I could be well off but any input from some experts would be much appreciated

 

[Kek700]

I am sadly no expert at anything, let alone setup's, but my 10p worth to get the ball rolling.

The wing is not a problem for Brands hatch, straights are too short, so I use a lot more wing on the 650S then I normally would.
Gearing can make quite a difference to lap times, I always find it comes down to a compromise, in the end, unfortunately, there is no fine adjustment for each gear.
I am used to the Nissan, for me, the 650S is not understeery,

I have to utilise TC, but there is, especially at brands time to be had in the TC setting. as I am not able to take this advantage, cannot recommend a setting. I use 2.
I use a lot of rear ARB here with the 650S, but will probably back that off for the race, only for qualifying.
I tend to change the camber quite a bit, does not seem to affect my lap times much, but seems to help tyre temps at brands, probably again, race and qually will have different camber settings.
Again rear diff coast and power is not so easy, I can run a lot of power in the 650S, and I do, but again for brands will go for stability, and probably for the race run 25 - 30%.
Coast, for stability I run 60%, but so tempting to go to 40 or 50%, the only problem is the 650 S does want to swap ends, when it does you are toast. It does help with turn in at 40%, but will keep 60%.
Trying to keep the LR tyre from overheating with soft's is my biggest problem at the moment, I can control it with TC and camber, but it affects my lap times, that is a difficult one.
I have had to change the dampers quite a lot, I cannot advise on that too much, that really is a can of worms, better not go there.
Be careful with the front roll bar, there can be a lot of lost time there, I usually run it stiff, I prefer the balance of a understeery car to, too much front end bite can destabilise the car.

When I have robbed some faster drivers setup invariably it will always have a softer front, springs and ARB, I always go faster, but the have to deal with a more difficult car. I then have to try and rebalance it again.

THE END

 

[Rob Every]

The biggest issue I find with car setups is pretty obvious.

And that is, if you find something elsewhere, you need to drive like that person to find that setup works for you.

I nearly always find setups downloaded here don't work, as I seemingly drive differently to most, very much on the nose with trail braking, a setup that a lot of people don't use. It hinders me in this game, especially in GT3 cars

And to be honest I don't think setups really make much difference, not to me anyway, I tried one recently that was ridiculous, massive ride height, to the max and was doing the same lap times basically as default.

Maybe to the aliens it helps, but to the rest of us it's a bit if a weak part of the game that you think will help, when in fact the main thing is exploiting the physics of the game, knowing the areas to tweak and driving to them.

In most cases it has NOTHING to do with real life car setup tweaks.

 

[Metla]

 

[Metla]

another

 

[JellyBeanz]

The biggest issue I find with car setups is pretty obvious.

And that is, if you find something elsewhere, you need to drive like that person to find that setup works for you.

I nearly always find setups downloaded here don't work, as I seemingly drive differently to most, very much on the nose with trail braking, a setup that a lot of people don't use. It hinders me in this game, especially in GT3 cars

And to be honest I don't think setups really make much difference, not to me anyway, I tried one recently that was ridiculous, massive ride height, to the max and was doing the same lap times basically as default.

Maybe to the aliens it helps, but to the rest of us it's a bit if a weak part of the game that you think will help, when in fact the main thing is exploiting the physics of the game, knowing the areas to tweak and driving to them.

In most cases it has NOTHING to do with real life car setup tweaks.

Yeah I've been putting in the time on my own in practice and find the pre-configured setups don't work as you stated, they are setups for that person's style.
One thing I've already learnt is that some of the work is for me to adjust my style as I'm probably a bit wrong and then some adjustment to the setup to mould the car to myself.

For example, at turn 1 at Brands I kept spinning while turning and downshifting. I've found to not brake as aggressive and setup the car to be a little more forgiving and now I take the corner with much more confidence.

Those two images above are a HUGE help so thank you very much!

 

[Kek700]

The simple solution is my main aim, I drive the car as fast as I can and look for problems.
Then, admittedly I know what to do, if you don’t I can see where the problem
then lies.
You, if you don’t know, will take the long route, experiment, if you do, then make adjustments to the point where the car is driving virtually faultless.
It may take you longer, the experimental route, but soon you will know what to adjust.
Next step is to make the car faster, now that it handles well for you,
That evokes, gearing, suspension heights, wing, toe, camber fine tuning, diff,
TC, maybe ABS, brake balance, dampers, tyre pressures.
The only problem then is separating the wheat from the chaff, you will be now doing many laps, is it you or the setup changes making you faster.
At this point I have maybe 4 or 5 setups, all stored, after I have eliminated the supposed false ones.
I leave it for a day or so, then return and just do three laps in each. That then sorts the unstable ones that I got used to driving, then i sort which ones actually make me quicker, removing all the false setups.
That usually leaves two setups, one for qualifying one for the race, more often just one.
Now do that for every circuit, and every car you are competitive in.
Luckily for me I can now short cut that, but, and this is a big but, you will still never be faster than the alien who turns up and drives the standard car setup much faster than i with all my faffing about.

 

[Rob Every]

I do also believe that in certain respects there are those in the know and those not regarding setups.

I have done hundreds of laps of Spa in GT3 cars recently, and certain cars are better than others, some I cant even get anywhere near the magic 2.20 barrier, some i can routinely hit 19's and 18.

Yet there are those that no matter what they drive are routinely in 15 and 16 bracket.

This I believe is partly due to ability, but MAINLY die to tricky, clicky setups, little tweaks that would appear dumb but just work in that track..

I am prepared to accept a second or maybe 2 at Spa is down to me, but sometimes you do wonder if you are missing something and at Spa in GT3 cars I am sure that is the case.

An example was years ago on Rfactor, oval racing league, basic cars that could be adjusted a fair bit, was doing OK, managed to get hold of a setup from a quick guy, instant wins, easy wins. So there is something in it as the setup was not immediately obvious as likely to work, it just hit quirks in the game, physics, track, tyre that somehow worked. This happens a lot in sims I think

 

[Kek700]

I basically agree, but in some sims there are frigs that work, like running zero camber, then going much quicker, never found anything remotely like it in AC.



I am pretty sure that I have covered all the combinations, I usually rotate SPA in 2 :20, but If really put my mind to it can manage mid 17’s , it is all down to how much speed I keep through each corner. I got this from following one of our aliens, they just have a way of holding onto corner speed. I give it away too easily.
Setups are useful, but can never replace that elusive, for me anyway, ability to hold onto as much speed as possible.
I am lucky, at times, I get a glimpse of it sometimes when I drive.
if you are a long way from a fast pace, it all looks like magic, or perhaps a magic setup, which does not exist.

 

[JellyBeanz]

2:22 at Spa for me is the fastest I can currently manage at spa and usually I'm hitting 2:24s.

Braking and turning (and keeping that corner speed!) Is what I'm lacking through lack of experience I think.

Guess I'll just have to race as much as possible

 

[Rob Every]

I dont think it is really down to ability, some of it is, but most of it is in tricky setups, and maybe some clever wheel fettling, so that you can just feel not on the limit when you are!

 

[Kek700]

That such a radical view point to compared to mine, cannot really agree or disagree.
It just confuses me.