Which Simracing Game has the Best F1 Content?

Andy_J · Mar 16, 2023

jonelsorel said:
But when it comes to facts, even Automobilista 1 is better at simulating a modern F1 car than EA's series, but don't quote me on that. Listen to Niels Heusinkveld, instead.

Don't talk rubbish man. AMS 1 is one of my faveourite race sims but come on, it does not simulate a complete F1 weekend. Get real.

davehenrie · Mar 16, 2023

Andy_J said:
Don't talk rubbish man. AMS 1 is one of my faveourite race sims but come on, it does not simulate a complete F1 weekend. Get real.

Andy, you are talking the entire Weekend experience. Jonel appears to be focusing soley on the car itself and how it drives. So you can both be correct.

Metla · Mar 16, 2023

Richard Wilks said:
Well the question was what simracing game has the best F1 content, not what simracing game gives you best "feelz".

And please, do explain exactly why the codies games have the "worst" physics, if no other game replicates mechanical components that are absolutely essential to recreate a modern F1.

Feels crap, Not convincing, Not enjoyable, immersion breaking.

That's the seat of the pants scientific method. Its all about the feels even if the correct data is in place and people write 4000 word posts on the subject.

Can't even spell phiscjs.

stenovitz · Mar 16, 2023

Content: rF1 mods.
Have a close to complete F1 season legacy, spanding from the birth in 1950 up to present day, more mods per season for several occasions.
Most of highest quality sim-wise, full real grids, season track packs and for early years most non-official events. Both as from-scratch and from excellent conversion work.
Far surpassing what I've been able to dig in AC for likewise depth for every season.

Unfortunately more of the season mod packs seems gone together with the old rF sites.

Strictly sim-wise:
RSS AC mods once again proves that even a half-bad base sim engine can be manipulated to real trustworthy single seater response.
Though rF2 F1 mods should be mentioned in one and same sentence, though a world of a different sim approach.

And still to this day I simply love Ralph Hummerich's season packs for F1C99-02. Of which I participated a couple of seasons in the Formula Simracing series during 2003-2005. Especially the RH05 pack is adorable.

BP · Mar 17, 2023

F1 cars (especially the more modern ones) have always been my first love in sim racing, so I've tried pretty much every iteration I could get my hands on:

Codemasters/EA: F1 2013 and all from 2018 - 22
AC: Official cars (F2004, Lotus 98T, etc) and Multiple RSS Formula Hybrid cars with CSP, SOL etc
R3E: Haven't tried this in awhile (probably 2020 - 21 was the last time) but all the F1-inspired cars up to that point.
AMS1: Every F1 car there
AMS2: Tried all F1 cars available during the first year of release; haven't checked it out in the last year or so.
RF2: I remember trying one of the V8 RedBull F1 mods and maybe a few others, but that was awhile ago as well (2020?)
iRacing: All F1 cars there, but mostly the Merc W12 and W13 (spent some time with the MP4-30 as well)

In terms of the F1 weekend and season experience, obviously nothing tops the official F1 games. Qualifying formats, flag rules, safety car procedures, car development, it pretty much has it all. However, it means little to me if I don't enjoy the feel of the car throughout the race.

In terms of the F1 driving experience with a wheel, the best one IMO is between AC's RSS cars and iRacing's W12/W13, but the one I choose to drive near exclusively these days is iRacing. I know most of RD's community haven't tried iRacing yet (and even those who have, they rarely ever try F1 cars since it's not base content), but if you're into the feel of driving current gen F1 cars, it's the best one in town. It gets even better when you do the 100% race distance events, when you really feel how the car changes over the race and how adjusting settings and technique pays off.

Richard Wilks said:
And let me already tell you this:

NONE of the "sims" we have simulate even the electronic diffs or active brake bias that real F1 cars have.

So please, fire away...

Not true. iRacing simulates all of this and more in the W12 and W13.

The Entry, Mid and Exit (called Hi-speed on Merc) differential settings are all modelled and adjustable.
The Peak Brake Bias that actively moves the overall bias more forward than the base bb setting is very much modelled and adjustable. How much brake pressure is needed to activate this active bias is also adjustable. Fine tuning the total brake bias +/- 1 percent (in 0.1% increments) is also there.
Engine Braking adjustments and how that also influences the car on entry is all modelled and adjustable.
Different energy deployment modes are modelled, but Mercedes insisted on simplifying them to 3 race modes (Attack, Balanced and Build) that attempt to target a SoC of 0%, 80% and 100% respectively. Whether to make the system simpler for users or to they were protecting sensitive data...or both...who knows...but it's there.
How the car progressively builds its ERS map during the first couple of laps is modelled.
Harvesting energy during deployment zones by slightly lifting the throttle is modelled.
Even the porpoising of the W13 is modelled and can be induced, at the risk of massive understeer when it happens.

Of course it's not perfect, no sim is, but iRacing's current F1 offerings IMO are the closest thing to the modern F1 driving experience in terms of how the car feels and all the systems/adjustments available to extract the best out of it. Yes the pace can be slightly off on some tracks, but there are certain things to consider:

1) the version of the car presented in sim is not necessarily the version of the car that drove IRL at that track that year; remember they make upgrades throughout the season that changes the performance. The W12 that set certain times at Imola in April is not the same version that iRacing modelled most likely later on.

2) Track state, track temp, air temp and humidity are all factors that affect engine and aero performance.

3) Track limits in sim may or may not be identical to IRL limits.

Stelcio · Mar 17, 2023

Horatio said:
You're not limited to single races in AC. You can play entire season in a form of custom championship. I did that and it wasn't (at least for me) that much different from doing a season in Codemasters F1. Obviously you won't get this type of immersion as Codemasters can deliver but many people don't care.

Well, you clearly haven't paid enough attention. Does AC have limited tyre sets allocation with ability (and sometimes necessity) to use a used set? No. Does it have preprogrammed practice programmes that adjust your strategy based on your results? No. Does it have team-bound pit positions that enforce pitting on a different lap than your teammate? No. Does it have ten different cars with different performance and handling, like a proper constructor championship, meaning different teams performing better or worse depenidng on a track? No. Does it have a safety car? No.

Now let's leave the championship mode and enter the career mode - you know, the main single player mode. Some simulation and otherwise features are exclusive to it. Let's leave the fact that AC doesn't even have a career mode and focus on those features. Does AC have engine wear simulation that carries over through an entire season, with performance loss and failure chance associated and with proper penalties for going over the part limit? No. Does AC have a car development system with different ways to change your car's performance, and with rival teams doing exactly the same through the season? No. Does AC have any kind of car development system? No. You drive the same car in the same condition in every single race. And so do your rivals.

Those aren't immersion features, those are simulation and competition features, that F1 games do have, while AC doesn't.

And for it to even have such a barebones representation of Formula 1 as it does have, it still needs a ton of mods and some work related to them. Cars? Mods. Tracks? Mods. Weather? Mods. Adjusting driver skills and car performance? Mods, and manual adjustment on top of that.

So I wouldn't say it's not that much different.

jonelsorel said:
There was someone (I believe more than one) asking for proof why F1 is not a F1 car simulator, by today's standards. I invite them to populate the following forums/discords for a couple of days in their physics/tech sections: AMS2, rFactor2, AC Custom Shaders Patch (discord), ACC, BeamNG Drive (the latter 2 not even in this poll, while F1 22 is, for some reason).

But when it comes to facts, even Automobilista 1 is better at simulating a modern F1 car than EA's series, but don't quote me on that. Listen to Niels Heusinkveld, instead.

Nice strawman. You keep hammering on that one single point - that it's not a car simulator. That's not the topic. The topic is simracing games and their content. And car simulators are usually bad simracing games as they don't have the necessary content to be good ones, focusing tightly on one aspect that is car simulation (hence the name).

You may prefer car simulations over simracing games, but "when it comes to facts", that doesn't make car simulations better simracing games than actual simracing games, or make them have better content.

But sure, come on, give me another LOL emoji without actually responding to my points and just cherrypick something else that you think you have a smart answer for. Seems like the only modus operandi that works for your discussion skills.

TRASGU · Mar 17, 2023

It has to be assetto corsa and Rfactor 1. The amount of content those sims have is unmatched

Richard Wilks · Mar 17, 2023

BP said:
F1 cars (especially the more modern ones) have always been my first love in sim racing, so I've tried pretty much every iteration I could get my hands on:

Codemasters/EA: F1 2013 and all from 2018 - 22

AC: Official cars (F2004, Lotus 98T, etc) and Multiple RSS Formula Hybrid cars with CSP, SOL etc

R3E: Haven't tried this in awhile (probably 2020 - 21 was the last time) but all the F1-inspired cars up to that point.

AMS1: Every F1 car there

AMS2: Tried all F1 cars available during the first year of release; haven't checked it out in the last year or so.

RF2: I remember trying one of the V8 RedBull F1 mods and maybe a few others, but that was awhile ago as well (2020?)

iRacing: All F1 cars there, but mostly the Merc W12 and W13 (spent some time with the MP4-30 as well)

In terms of the F1 weekend and season experience, obviously nothing tops the official F1 games. Qualifying formats, flag rules, safety car procedures, car development, it pretty much has it all. However, it means little to me if I don't enjoy the feel of the car throughout the race.

In terms of the F1 driving experience with a wheel, the best one IMO is between AC's RSS cars and iRacing's W12/W13, but the one I choose to drive near exclusively these days is iRacing. I know most of RD's community haven't tried iRacing yet (and even those who have, they rarely ever try F1 cars since it's not base content), but if you're into the feel of driving current gen F1 cars, it's the best one in town. It gets even better when you do the 100% race distance events, when you really feel how the car changes over the race and how adjusting settings and technique pays off.

Not true. iRacing simulates all of this and more in the W12 and W13.

The Entry, Mid and Exit (called Hi-speed on Merc) differential settings are all modelled and adjustable.

The Peak Brake Bias that actively moves the overall bias more forward than the base bb setting is very much modelled and adjustable. How much brake pressure is needed to activate this active bias is also adjustable. Fine tuning the total brake bias +/- 1 percent (in 0.1% increments) is also there.

Engine Braking adjustments and how that also influences the car on entry is all modelled and adjustable.

Different energy deployment modes are modelled, but Mercedes insisted on simplifying them to 3 race modes (Attack, Balanced and Build) that attempt to target a SoC of 0%, 80% and 100% respectively. Whether to make the system simpler for users or to they were protecting sensitive data...or both...who knows...but it's there.

How the car progressively builds its ERS map during the first couple of laps is modelled.

Harvesting energy during deployment zones by slightly lifting the throttle is modelled.

Even the porpoising of the W13 is modelled and can be induced, at the risk of massive understeer when it happens.

Of course it's not perfect, no sim is, but iRacing's current F1 offerings IMO are the closest thing to the modern F1 driving experience in terms of how the car feels and all the systems/adjustments available to extract the best out of it. Yes the pace can be slightly off on some tracks, but there are certain things to consider:

1) the version of the car presented in sim is not necessarily the version of the car that drove IRL at that track that year; remember they make upgrades throughout the season that changes the performance. The W12 that set certain times at Imola in April is not the same version that iRacing modelled most likely later on.

2) Track state, track temp, air temp and humidity are all factors that affect engine and aero performance.

3) Track limits in sim may or may not be identical to IRL limits.

I'll give that to iracing, they did modelled many of the systems, which is great to see.

But saying the pace is "bit" off is a massive understatement. Real laptimes were broken almost imediatly after the car came out, and now they are multiple seconds off in most tracks. Sure we can accept some deviation from what the real modelled car was vs what version raced on some tracks, but the difference is way too big to account for that.

And of course, altough this car is okish, iracing only have this one, and lacks everything else that the codies games has.

orange400 · Mar 17, 2023

From what I recall: AMS1

Has the best combination of car quality, variety, offline AI and mods.
Assetto has the RSS Formulas, but AC lacks in AI, comparatively. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

Stelcio · Mar 17, 2023

The time-matching argument is silly anyway.

First of all, no real driver pushes their car to the degree players push their virtual cars. Not only because of the risks associated, but also because they don't have time to find all the setup tricks, and they can't exploit each sim's individual quirks and then they can't just practice each hundredth from the track. So even if we'll get an absolute perfect simulation of a car, virtual drivers will still be faster with it.

Another factor is that let's say we have W13 in iRacing. Which one? From which race? Those cars change for each race, sometimes subtly, sometimes dramatically. Unless we have an information that this is the recreation of the version of the car from this particular race, we can't really compare times. And then, we can only compare them on this particular track. And then, my first point comes to effect and the comparison is pointless anyway.

EDIT: Oh, and I forgot. F1 drivers never set up their cars for one lap performance due to parc ferme rule. So, obviously, a full time trial setup on a simulated car will be quicker.

Richard Wilks · Mar 17, 2023

Stelcio said:
The time-matching argument is silly anyway.

First of all, no real driver pushes their car to the degree players push their virtual cars. Not only because of the risks associated, but also because they don't have time to find all the setup tricks, and they can't exploit each sim's individual quirks and then they can't just practice each hundredth from the track. So even if we'll get an absolute perfect simulation of a car, virtual drivers will still be faster with it.

Another factor is that let's say we have W13 in iRacing. Which one? From which race? Those cars change for each race, sometimes subtly, sometimes dramatically. Unless we have an information that this is the recreation of the version of the car from this particular race, we can't really compare times. And then, we can only compare them on this particular track. And then, my first point comes to effect and the comparison is pointless anyway.

EDIT: Oh, and I forgot. F1 drivers never set up their cars for one lap performance due to parc ferme rule. So, obviously, a full time trial setup on a simulated car will be quicker.

That is just an excuse. If real drivers wouldnt push their cars to the max, they would not be doing their job. If the sim has "quirks and tricks" , then its not much of a sim. A Virtual driver might still be faster with a perfect sim, but not to the degree of several seconds a lap like we see in many cases.

Again, the "car changes race to race" doesnt account for the massive differences we see in the W12 in iracing. The car might as well be a totally diferent car by then.

Stelcio · Mar 17, 2023

Richard Wilks said:
That is just an excuse. If real drivers wouldnt push their cars to the max, they would not be doing their job.

They are doing their job. But there are factors outside their control that I mentioned, and there are limits to human abilities that you can get around in a sim by sheer unlimited, free-of-consequence trial and error.

You can take a look at qualis in F1 Esports. The differences are minimal, because everybody extracts the absolute maximum from the car. That's what happens when you can just drive one combo for hundreds of hours and test every single setup combination, looking for one that's perfect for that specific purpose.

OTOH you have Fernando Alonso, who says one of his great strenghts is his experience, and the fact that he has several more races on each track over his rivals. He specifically said that he can extract more time from the track simply because he has driven this track more. Not the case for racing sims, because aliens just do as many laps in a week on one track, as he did in his entire career.

Richard Wilks said:
If the sim has "quirks and tricks" , then its not much of a sim.

Every sim has quirks and tricks. Simulation is always a simplified version of reality. Even F1 teams botch their simulations, just look at Mercedes. And those sims are actual scientific tools.
So quite too high of a standard you put there, IMO, an unachievable one.

Richard Wilks said:
Again, the "car changes race to race" doesnt account for the massive differences we see in the W12 in iracing. The car might as well be a totally diferent car by then.

W12 from Monaco is drastically different from W12 from Monza, and time differences would easily be in several seconds. I'm not defending iRacing's simulation here though. They most likely are some degree off the mark, as most simulations are, even Mercedes' own, which is the reason for their current struggles.

My only point is that validating one simulation over another based on time matching is silly, because the conditions in which those times were achieved are vastly different, and you can just as well have a matched time with a bad simulation, as you can have a different time in a good simulation.

Richard Wilks · Mar 17, 2023

Stelcio said:
They are doing their job. But there are factors outside their control that I mentioned, and there are limits to human abilities that you can get around in a sim by sheer unlimited, free-of-consequence trial and error.

You can take a look at qualis in F1 Esports. The differences are minimal, because everybody extracts the absolute maximum from the car. That's what happens when you can just drive one combo for hundreds of hours and test every single setup combination, looking for one that's perfect for that specific purpose.

OTOH you have Fernando Alonso, who says one of his great strenghts is his experience, and the fact that he has several more races on each track over his rivals. He specifically said that he can extract more time from the track simply because he has driven this track more. Not the case for racing sims, because aliens just do as many laps in a week on one track, as he did in his entire career.

Every sim has quirks and tricks. Simulation is always a simplified version of reality. Even F1 teams botch their simulations, just look at Mercedes. And those sims are actual scientific tools.
So quite too high of a standard you put there, IMO, an unachievable one.

W12 from Monaco is drastically different from W12 from Monza, and time differences would easily be in several seconds. I'm not defending iRacing's simulation here though. They most likely are some degree off the mark, as most simulations are, even Mercedes' own, which is the reason for their current struggles.

My only point is that validating one simulation over another based on time matching is silly, because the conditions in which those times were achieved are vastly different, and you can just as well have a matched time with a bad simulation, as you can have a different time in a good simulation.

Oh its not silly at all. IT is the ONLY thing we have going for it. Why do you think even Niels has those videos comparing himself directly with an onboard lap?

If you dont have telemetry, then an onboard and a laptime is the best next thing.

Setups are not an excuse again, because that would only slow the cars down, if you have the wrong configuration for a given track, not make you actually GAIN time.

Sure simracers can do 1000s of laps in one track, but the car limits are the car limits , they dont grow to the rate of seconds a lap just because you keep lapping.

Simulators might be simplifications of reality, but that still doesnt excuse them being botched to the point of having tricks to gain free speed by just dropping the wings, disconnecting roll bars, maximize toe angles, or driving on the grass to cool tires.

Stelcio · Mar 17, 2023

Richard Wilks said:
Oh its not silly at all. IT is the ONLY thing we have going for it. Why do you think even Niels has those videos comparing himself directly with an onboard lap?

He probably does that because he's a content creator and a salesman. He needs content that catches people's attention which he can transform into purchases of his products.

I think he's perfectly aware of flaws of such comparisons, but that's probably not what he was thinking of when making them.

And I don't see how it's the only thing we have going for, because as far as I'm concerned, we don't have that going for it either. And just because we lack good gauges of virtual car's fidelity, it doesn't mean we should accept subpar ones as better than they really are.

Richard Wilks said:
Setups are not an excuse again, because that would only slow the cars down, if you have the wrong configuration for a given track, not make you actually GAIN time.

If you can lose time with worse setup, you can gain time with better setup. It cannot work one way only. And with limited track time, you can't find perfect settings like in simracing.

On top of that I will again mention the parc ferme rule. Formula 1 teams look for best balanced settings for both race and quali. They don't use sharp edge one lap setups. So you're comparing virtual laptimes to laps made with a car that was intentionally gimped when it comes to one lap pace in order to have better race pace.

Richard Wilks said:
Sure simracers can do 1000s of laps in one track, but the car limits are the car limits , they dont grow to the rate of seconds a lap just because you keep lapping.

Yeah, but that's one more factor that cumulates with the other ones.

Richard Wilks said:
Simulators might be simplifications of reality, but that still doesnt excuse them being botched to the point of having tricks to gain free speed by just dropping the wings, disconnecting roll bars, maximize toe angles, or driving on the grass to cool tires.

Agreed here, although those are the most extreme examples.

Richard Wilks · Mar 17, 2023

Stelcio said:
He probably does that because he's a content creator and a salesman. He needs content that catches people's attention which he can transform into purchases of his products.

I think he's perfectly aware of flaws of such comparisons, but that's probably not what he was thinking of when making them.

And I don't see how it's the only thing we have going for, because as far as I'm concerned, we don't have that going for it either. And just because we lack good gauges of virtual car's fidelity, it doesn't mean we should accept subpar ones as better than they really are.

If you can lose time with worse setup, you can gain time with better setup. It cannot work one way only. And with limited track time, you can't find perfect settings like in simracing.

On top of that I will again mention the parc ferme rule. Formula 1 teams look for best balanced settings for both race and quali. They don't use sharp edge one lap setups. So you're comparing virtual laptimes to laps made with a car that was intentionally gimped when it comes to one lap pace in order to have better race pace.

Yeah, but that's one more factor that cumulates with the other ones.

Agreed here, although those are the most extreme examples.

You are wrong, HE does that to demonstrate and to see himself how close he is of the real thing. He is not a content creator, and couldnt care less about youtube metrics, he has a hardware business.

We should accept anything we can use, and that is one thing we can use. If we dont use even that, what will we do? Gauge the performance of the virtual representation by what?... Some objectivety needs to be used, or else we might as well play micro machines.

A better setup doesnt give you multiple seconds a lap.

I can compare the race laptimes in F1, they are much faster also.

Horatio · Mar 17, 2023

@Stelcio Surely AC doesn't have all of the features which you mentioned, but this is not something I would care about. What is the most important part to me is the driving itself and that's why I think AC is better as a F1 simulator. I am not even saying that it is more realistic because I have never driven any F1 irl, but it's simply more enjoyable and that's very important bit.

Stelcio said:
Does it have ten different cars with different performance and handling, like a proper constructor championship, meaning different teams performing better or worse depenidng on a track?

From 2022 season? Obviously no. But I don't like the modern crap ( I just can't stand V6 noise). V10, V8 this my way to go.

Does Codemasters have 10 different vehicles from 2004 or 2005 and the ability to do some career around them? Probably no. AC does - in the form of MSF and VRC mods.

What about the vintage stuff? Does Codemasters have entire grid (or at least 6-7 cars) from 1967 season? AC does.

Same about 1991 season.

These are the things which makes that AC is better F1 game to me.

Horatio · Mar 17, 2023

Andy_J said:
Hotlapping in a F1 car is all that AC is good for.

That's your opinion. I have opposite experience, different requirements and I prefer to do entire season in AC rather than Codemasters game. I am not saying that F1 22 is bad though.

jonelsorel · Mar 17, 2023

Stelcio said:
Well, you clearly haven't paid enough attention. Does AC have limited tyre sets allocation with ability (and sometimes necessity) to use a used set? No. Does it have preprogrammed practice programmes that adjust your strategy based on your results? No. Does it have team-bound pit positions that enforce pitting on a different lap than your teammate? No. Does it have ten different cars with different performance and handling, like a proper constructor championship, meaning different teams performing better or worse depenidng on a track? No. Does it have a safety car? No.

Now let's leave the championship mode and enter the career mode - you know, the main single player mode. Some simulation and otherwise features are exclusive to it. Let's leave the fact that AC doesn't even have a career mode and focus on those features. Does AC have engine wear simulation that carries over through an entire season, with performance loss and failure chance associated and with proper penalties for going over the part limit? No. Does AC have a car development system with different ways to change your car's performance, and with rival teams doing exactly the same through the season? No. Does AC have any kind of car development system? No. You drive the same car in the same condition in every single race. And so do your rivals.

Those aren't immersion features, those are simulation and competition features, that F1 games do have, while AC doesn't.

And for it to even have such a barebones representation of Formula 1 as it does have, it still needs a ton of mods and some work related to them. Cars? Mods. Tracks? Mods. Weather? Mods. Adjusting driver skills and car performance? Mods, and manual adjustment on top of that.

So I wouldn't say it's not that much different.

Nice strawman. You keep hammering on that one single point - that it's not a car simulator. That's not the topic. The topic is simracing games and their content. And car simulators are usually bad simracing games as they don't have the necessary content to be good ones, focusing tightly on one aspect that is car simulation (hence the name).

You may prefer car simulations over simracing games, but "when it comes to facts", that doesn't make car simulations better simracing games than actual simracing games, or make them have better content.

But sure, come on, give me another LOL emoji without actually responding to my points and just cherrypick something else that you think you have a smart answer for. Seems like the only modus operandi that works for your discussion skills.

You write a lot, but you could communicate the same ideas in a more condensed way. The first word in "simracing" is sim.

Nobody in their right mind would argue that AC is (or should be) the top F1 sim. But this 8 year old game does simulate the few F1 cars it has better than any game from the Codemasters/EA's F1 franchise. Do look into the details.

The point is that no game from Codemasters/EA F1 franchise has a reason to populate a list of simracing titles next to iRacing, rFactor2 or Automobilista 2 simply because it doesn't simulate the cars you get to drive at the same level of realism you get when averaging the other true sims available on the market with respect to the cars they are simulating. Simple as that. Again, do some digging if you're interested to find out what's really best in the world of simracing and not just in an argument. No one should put their research on a platter whenever someone else asks "prove it". I've done my own, I'm currently at my 5th steering wheel/pedal set, and really am looking forward to wearing it down playing the best simulations there are, not annual wannabes.

And sure, you can play whatever racing game on your sim rig, but is that simracing to you? If so, I beg your pardon for this whole intervention.

Richard Wilks · Mar 17, 2023

Horatio said:
@Stelcio Surely AC doesn't have all of the features which you mentioned, but this is not something I would care about. What is the most important part to me is the driving itself and that's why I think AC is better as a F1 simulator. I am not even saying that it is more realistic because I have never driven any F1 irl, but it's simply more enjoyable and that's very important bit.

From 2022 season? Obviously no. But it does have 10 different cars from 2004 season (MSF mod) and 2 cars from 2005 (VRC) - glorious V10 era and these are the season which I want to play not the modern crap ( I just can't stand V6 and hybrid stuff). Does Codemasters have 10 different vehicles from 2004 or 2005 and the ability to do some career around them? Probably no.

What matters to you most is the driving. and yet, the RSS F1 is not in the same league or accuracy as the iracing or the codies one, so how can in any world be possible that by that criteria, AC is the better simulator?...

Oh and by the way, the early 2000s cars had electronic diffs already, electronic actuated engine breaking and traction control.

Richard Wilks · Mar 17, 2023

jonelsorel said:
You write a lot, but you could communicate the same ideas in a more condensed way. The first word in "simracing" is sim.

Nobody in their right mind would argue that AC is (or should be) the top F1 sim. But this 8 year old game does simulate the few F1 cars it has better than any game from the Codemasters/EA's F1 franchise. Do look into the details.

The point is that any game from Codemasters/EA F1 franchise has no reason to populate a list of simsracing games, next to iRacing, rFactor2 or Automobilista 2 simply because it doesn't simulate the car you are driving to the level of realism you get when averaging the other true sims available on the market with respect to the cars they are simulating. Simple as that.

And sure, you can play whatever racing game on your sim rig, but is that simracing to you? If so, I beg your pardon for this whole intervention.

And who decides what is "sim", you?

Please show exactly why are the physics of the codies games less "sim" than the games you mentioned, with actual facts about game engines, systems simulated, tire models, and some telemetry to go along with it please. Or even just some onboard video comparisons.

Which Simracing Game has the Best F1 Content?

Which racing games do you use to drive F1 cars?

Raceroom Racing Experience

Automobilista 2

F1 22

Assetto Corsa

iRacing

F1 simulator: More than just driving​

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Competition and adrenaline

Practice for real racing

Community and simracers

F1 simulator: More than just driving