Automobilista 2: New Preview Video Released

[Paul Jeffrey]

Not satisfied with the last Automobilista 2 video footage? Well wrap your eyes around this one...

Reiza Studios recently revealed a new comparison video of the developing Automobilista 2 simulation, showing the game in direct comparison to its older brother AMS 1, and featuring the work-in-progress Snetterton Circuit in the UK.

Despite obviously being a significant upgrade over the original title, many fans were a little underwhelmed by how development of Automobilista 2 looked to be progressing from a visual point of view, something that Reiza Studios have acknowledged when reading the comments section of the various articles featuring the July roadmap post.

Having another shot at wowing the crowds, Reiza have recently dropped a much improved video of the Ultima GTR lapping around the Snetterton track in various time of day conditions - and it's fair to say the visual improvements are considerable...

Capture has a higher bitrate which is more accurate to the game´s actual graphical quality" said Reiza Studios Renato Simioni.

Other differences in this new video include improvements to track lighting, updated road and foliage shaders, revised textures; smoothed cockpit model edges & updated materials; adjustments to audio code, rebalancing of engine sounds and various sound effects (also replacing a few placeholders used in the original video); updated physics and increased game graphical settings.

Should be stated perhaps that this still isn´t the most exciting car / track combo or settings to promote AMS2 which wasn´t really the point of the original video - obviously we miscalculated how closely people would be looking!

This is a better representation of AMS2 in its current stage of development but it´s still a WIP - things will change as we progress to release and continue to afterwards. Such is the nature of the thing...
​

So, what do you think?

Automobilista 2 will release for PC December 2019.

For the latest Automobilista 2 news and discussions, head over to the AMS 2 sub forum here at RaceDepartment and get yourself involved in the conversation today!

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[Danny kung]

As much as I've enjoyed AMS the prospect of drop in full grid races in Brazillian Stock Cars, Mini's, Super V8's, Boxer Cup, Formula Classic etc etc is simply mouth watering.

Is it weird my mouth was literally watering as I read this? I pray that it is this good. that is all

 

[Level88]

My only advice to people is to NOT PREORDER. That has become the Achilles heal of gamers and sim racers alike. All of what is said above is conjecture. Look at ACC, no proper triple screen support in a driving sim. Look at Dirt Rally 2. Selling Dirt Rally 1 content as premium content.
Consumers are being taken for a ride all the time in this industry and the only way to put a stop to it is to get the answers to the questions we all have before we put any money down.

Normally I'd agree with this statement and don't usually pre-order games, but Reiza have earned a lot of goodwill the way they continued to improve AMS1 and release free DLC for season pass holders which is why people were happy to sign up to the early backing campaign for AMS2.

For a small company like Reiza getting some cash flow up front can help pay for things like licensing costs which wouldn't be a concern for EA or Codemasters as they have financial resources.

I doubt companies like Kunos, Reiza, S397 etc are in business to take consumers for a ride as they continue to support and develop their software for a long time after initial release unlike some other less scrupulous developers.

 

[Alex72]

PC2 supports triple screens and I'm pretty sure Reiza have said this feature will carry over to AMS2.

Oh thats awesome to hear. Do PC2 have multiview or in-game triple screen app to set bezel, angle of side monitors, size etc?

 

[Alex72]

But he likes AMS1 graphics so I don't think he will be happy. You can't please all the people ....

AMS1 will still exist when AMS2 comes out so perhaps you can. I still regularly drive GT Legends and GTR2.

I have a feeling Reiza might tweak the graphics too to their liking (if they are allowed with the engine). Knowing how hard Reiza always works i wouldnt be surprised if AMS2 isnt graphically exactly like PC2. I could be wrong of course.

 

[ls13coco]

If you backed at Level 5 or above yes, see here for info and to grab your keys https://forum.reizastudios.com/threads/automobilista-2-early-backing-campaign.6233/

Guess I should have looked deeper into Reiza51.
Thanks man, got my key for backing level 5 now.

 

[Spinelli]

@Spinelli I disagreed with the premise that you have to compromise something in the ISI motor to have that desired effect that you describe, and specially that it needs to somehow make the steering "mush" for it. You have made your mission to criticize game engines for this for years now, and i am arguing the point that it's NOT the game engine per se, it's the implementation of said cars.

You and another person or 2 over the years have said it's not the game engine but the implementation of cars where the problem lies. I've never seen any evidence of that in almost 20 years of being heavily involved in simracing yet I've seen the complete opposite time and time again after literally hundreds if not thousands of cars and tons of different developers/modders (there's only so much u can do and manipulate without truly having access to the core physics engine coding - regardless of which videogame or type of videogame).

I think you're heavily underestimating how important and how much influence a videogames' physics engine makes. That's the underlying technology, the underlying coding, formulas, algorithms, etc. "driving" (no pun intended) everything. It's no different to a sound engine, graphics engine, U.I. engine, A.I. "engine," etc.; there's only so much you can do in any aspect of any videogame without changing the underlying code.

For example, modders/users can tinker with the rFactor 1 player.PLR file along with individual cars' A.I. files as much as they want but it'll never fully replicate rFactor 2's A.I. because ISI modified the A.I. coding under the hood (A.I. "engine"). Apart from some more/differeny A.I. "features" being available to the player/modder to adjust in the A.I. files and such, there are A.I. fundamental coding changes which have taken place undermeath the hood - the details of which none of us have access to.

 

[Tar Heel]

Normally I'd agree with this statement and don't usually pre-order games, but Reiza have earned a lot of goodwill the way they continued to improve AMS1 and release free DLC for season pass holders which is why people were happy to sign up to the early backing campaign for AMS2.

For a small company like Reiza getting some cash flow up front can help pay for things like licensing costs which wouldn't be a concern for EA or Codemasters as they have financial resources.

I doubt companies like Kunos, Reiza, S397 etc are in business to take consumers for a ride as they continue to support and develop their software for a long time after initial release unlike some other less scrupulous developers.

Kunos isn't in the same class of small developer like Reiza anymore since they were bought by Digital Bros. They have way more financial backing.

 

[David Wright]

Oh thats awesome to hear. Do PC2 have multiview or in-game triple screen app to set bezel, angle of side monitors, size etc?

I don't have triples but from this video it seems to be in-game

 

[Richard Wilks]

You and another person or 2 over the years have said it's not the game engine but the implementation of cars where the problem lies. I've never seen any evidence of that in almost 20 years of being heavily involved in simracing yet I've seen the complete opposite time and time again after literally hundreds if not thousands of cars and tons of different developers/modders (there's only so much u can do and manipulate without truly having access to the core physics engine coding - regardless of which videogame ir type of videogame).

I think you're heavily underestimating how important and how much influence a videogames' physics engine makes. That's the underlying technology, the underlying coding, formulas, algorithms, etc. "driving" (no pun intended) everything. It's no different to a sound engine, graphics engine, U.I. engine, A.I. "engine," etc.; there's only so much you can do in any aspect of any videogame without changing the underlying code.

For example, modders/users can tinker with the rFactor 1 player.PLR file along with individual cars' A.I. files as much as they want but it'll never fully replicate rFactor 2's A.I. because ISI modified the A.I. coding under the hood (A.I. "engine"). Apart from some more/differeny A.I. "features" being available to the player/modder to adjust in the A.I. files and such, there are A.I. fundamental coding changes which have taken place undermeath the hood - the details of which none of us have access to.

No, its you who underestimate how much work and how much knowledge i did and have of the ISI physics engine. You have no proof of anything besides your "perceptions", while i have hard data and many many different physics iterations to back me up. Believe me, there are flaws yes, but they are not where you think they are, and certainly it's not because you played a lot of games in the lat 20 years that you will suddenly have the knowledge to discuss these things.

What you "feel" is more a school of creating virtual cars rather than the engine itself, i stress again. It's no coincidence that some common traits could be found in distinct gaming engines.

 

[torsteinvh]

Oh thats awesome to hear. Do PC2 have multiview or in-game triple screen app to set bezel, angle of side monitors, size etc?

In-game app, works very well.
Here's an example of the left screen configuration:

 

[Marc Collins]

No, its you who underestimate how much work and how much knowledge i did and have of the ISI physics engine. You have no proof of anything besides your "perceptions", while i have hard data and many many different physics iterations to back me up. Believe me, there are flaws yes, but they are not where you think they are, and certainly it's not because you played a lot of games in the lat 20 years that you will suddenly have the knowledge to discuss these things.

What you "feel" is more a school of creating virtual cars rather than the engine itself, i stress again. It's no coincidence that some common traits could be found in distinct gaming engines.

The simple proof of this is that not ALL cars exhibit the tail-happy inappropriate weight-shifting traits that are the subject of so many tomes. I have already challenged @Spinelli multiple times to explain the logic of how it can be the physics engine if even one example of a car that does not exhibit the trait can be found. We already have plenty of them in AMS, but apparently there is still something wrong with the engine.

Careless copy and pasting of physics input assumptions is rampant--even among professional devs, but especially among hobbyist modders. Less than fully knowledgable people designing sim cars is also rampant. And there is real-world racing physics and detailed knowledge of the sim itself that must be combined to produce a superior product. Getting input from real racing teams or plugging in real-world values carte blanche into a sim does not produce the best sim vehicle unless the sim itself is a near-perfect simulation of real life (which none of them are...yet). Tire behaviour isn't even fully understood by the world's best tire engineers.

If 99.9% of all the cars in rF, rf2, GTR 2, R3E, RACE, GSCE, AMS, etc., all had the bad traits, it still wouldn't be purely the physics engine's fault if a single car (0.1%) in one of the titles did not. AMS alone is about 90% to the good, so argument already lost in my opinion.

 

[Mike Kadlcak]

I agree with @Spinelli as I am am waiting after all this years on a better simulated tire where we can just floor it out of the pits and do not have to worry about a magical 180deg. spin or worse (in an open wheel downforce car) and just counter steer where we want it. Maybe one day Dave from iR will figure it out. Or somebody else

 

[Marc Collins]

I agree with @Spinelli as I am am waiting after all this years on a better simulated tire where we can just floor it out of the pits and do not have to worry about a magical 180deg. spin or worse (in an open wheel downforce car) and just counter steer where we want it. Maybe one day Dave from iR will figure it out. Or somebody else

Assume this is a joke...?

But just in case it is not, a super-powerful extremely lightweight car will do a 180 degree spin or worse when you floor it out of the pits. Especially since all the down force accouterments are completely non-functional at that point.

 

[ShadowHornet]

Assume this is a joke...?

But just in case it is not, a super-powerful extremely lightweight car will do a 180 degree spin or worse when you floor it out of the pits. Especially since all the down force accouterments are completely non-functional at that point.

Exactly! Low speed => low air flow => low downforce. People should have understood and get used to it long ago.

 

[Ghoults]

Assume this is a joke...?

But just in case it is not, a super-powerful extremely lightweight car will do a 180 degree spin or worse when you floor it out of the pits. Especially since all the down force accouterments are completely non-functional at that point.

If lance stroll or johnny dumfries can get out of the pits with the rear tires smoking without an incident but the same thing is borderline impossible in sim you know something is not right. Spins in the pits in real life are incredibly rare considering during race pit stops it is sideways burnouts everytime a car leaves the pitbox.

 

[Spinelli]

The simple proof of this is that not ALL cars exhibit the tail-happy inappropriate weight-shifting traits that are the subject of so many tomes. I have already challenged @Spinelli multiple times to explain the logic of how it can be the physics engine if even one example of a car that does not exhibit the trait can be found. We already have plenty of them in AMS, but apparently there is still something wrong with the engine...

...If 99.9% of all the cars in rF, rf2, GTR 2, R3E, RACE, GSCE, AMS, etc., all had the bad traits, it still wouldn't be purely the physics engine's fault if a single car (0.1%) in one of the titles did not. AMS alone is about 90% to the good, so argument already lost in my opinion.

Argument can't be lost because there isn't a single car where most if not all the traits don't occur. And to say AMS is 90% to the good is utterly ridiculous (as much as I love AMS & Reiza) because all this stuff can be replicated in AMS as well (although they have slightly improved things).

The reason why I'm so convinced it's a core physics engine thing, as I've already said multiple times, is because all of it can be replicated in any car, any mod. Even Project Cars 1 which apparently uses their own scratch-made tyre model exhibits it; I noticed it within the 3rd corner of my first ever lap playing the game before I even knew it's physics engine was ISI/rF based (besides tyre model). That's how obvious I can spot it. I didn't even know PC1 was based on ISI's engine, so those traits weren't even on my mind before I noticed them.

And challenging me? I've gone into lengthy posts explaining multiple issues many times. I've also posted real-life videos of situations which vastly differ. I believe it was you who responded by saying you can produce everything in a video I posted in the ISI physics engine (or maybe specifically AMS, not sure). Did you ever show a video of you doing so? Nope. Nothing.

Please show me the same type of vehicle behavior there. Please show me big oversteer angles, oversteer angles being held for a long time, having the car not snap back inline once the oversteer angle decreases and the car straightens out, being able to absolutely floor the throttle while in the middle of the slide and continuing the with floored throttle until the end of the slide, having the oversteer initiate slowly without having to do sudden snaps of the wheel or multiple quick "jerks," having the car continue on it's natural trajectory/path towards the outside of the corner while some/all the above is happening, etc.

Please show me that with open-wheelers in AMS. F3s, F1s, etc.

Or, get the 95 Ferrari F1 in AMS and induce a bunch of wheelspin on the exit out of a tight-corner while your car still has a lot of steering angle put in then, while the oversteer angle is still going and in a static (oversteer angle neither decreasing nor increasing) sideways state, controllably modulate/adjust the wheelspin and slide angle, then floor the throttle while adding opposite lock to compensate and keep the throttle floored while the wheelspin slowly dies down on it's own as you leave huge strips of black rubber down the straight. I showed a good example of this in a 1996 F1 car a few pages back in this thread.

But just in case it is not, a super-powerful extremely lightweight car will do a 180 degree spin or worse when you floor it out of the pits. Especially since all the down force accouterments are completely non-functional at that point.

They CAN spin or worse but they don't have too. I've seen millions of videos of open-wheel cars getting floored while sideways...or, while sideways, they give a little lift of the throttle but just a bit while still keeping lots of wheelspin and oversteer angle and they can then manipulate/control the wheelspin and angle. This is common stuff throughout racing. I sometimes wonder if, short of really racing themselves (expensive and not common), if some people even watch racing and observe car behavior. It literally takes just a few minutes of watching an open-wheel practice session or race to see.

Also, then blaming it on lack of downforce is a logical fallacy. Yes, there's little to no downforce between 0 and what, 80 km/h give or take 20? Regardless, downforce adds outright grip (it adds the effect of more mass without the negative effects of more actual mass) but fundamental physics still apply regardless of outright grip. FIner characteristics will change depending on grip/downforce (just like characteristics change between different cars, tyres, setups, etc.) but the "bigger picture" doesn't change.

In real-life, when a vehicle's rear tyres are slipping and an oversteer situation is occurring, the car doesn't behave as if mass and weight suddenly stopped existing, or as if the tyres lost 99.9% of grip or contact with the road-surface, or as if the car suddenly gained 500% torque. Making a blanket statement like [paraphrasing] "a car has lots of power and is lightweight so it should automatically spin-out" is extremely misinforming and is just false.

It's the same arguments fans of "x" racing sim use. A car is super powerful so it should spin. Tyres are cold so the car should instantly spin. No/little downforce so car should instantly spin. These are all false and watching literally any car from any racing series from any decade "should" make this obvious to anyone.

 

[Richard Wilks]

@Spinelli

You keep harping your arguments over and over, but you have no proof whatsoever, no detailed analysis, no excel sheet with multiple slip angle or inertia changes, no different cars to compare, no nothing. I can make a car in AMS that behave just like those F3 you have in your video. But then you might say "oh the steering is mushy" like you said before. F1 cars in codies behave like that but "oh but its simcade garbage".

You can't seem to make up your own mind, and i will repeat again, what you talk about is a "school" of doing a virtual car. TIme and time again i hear people wanting "crisp" steerings and tons of steering "feedback", and then accuse PCars2 of being "too slidy.

You are not wrong abotu the F V12 in AMS, but like i said, more than a problem of engine, its a problem of what has been done in the past in games, together with simracers expectations.

Oh and i can floor the gas on one of my cart88 cars out of the pits without being scared of spinning.

 

[matiaslee]

Fascinating

Yep that's my idea.
Without mods, a sim has no possibility.
To revive those legendary motorsports scenes, to drive against a historic field in a championship, to organise a custom race by choosing from all cars, that's why I play sim

 

[Marc Collins]

Argument can't be lost because there isn't a single car where most if not all the traits don't occur. And to say AMS is 90% to the good is utterly ridiculous (as much as I love AMS & Reiza) because all this stuff can be replicated in AMS as well (although they have slightly improved things).

The reason why I'm so convinced it's a core physics engine thing, as I've already said multiple times, is because all of it can be replicated in any car, any mod. Even Project Cars 1 which apparently uses their own scratch-made tyre model exhibits it; I noticed it within the 3rd corner of my first ever lap playing the game before I even knew it's physics engine was ISI/rF based (besides tyre model). That's how obvious I can spot it. I didn't even know PC1 was based on ISI's engine, so those traits weren't even on my mind before I noticed them.

And challenging me? I've gone into lengthy posts explaining multiple issues many times. I've also posted real-life videos of situations which vastly differ. I believe it was you who responded by saying you can produce everything in a video I posted in the ISI physics engine (or maybe specifically AMS, not sure). Did you ever show a video of you doing so? Nope. Nothing.

Please show me the same type of vehicle behavior there. Please show me big oversteer angles, oversteer angles being held for a long time, having the car not snap back inline once the oversteer angle decreases and the car straightens out, being able to absolutely floor the throttle while in the middle of the slide and continuing the with floored throttle until the end of the slide, having the oversteer initiate slowly without having to do sudden snaps of the wheel or multiple quick "jerks," having the car continue on it's natural trajectory/path towards the outside of the corner while some/all the above is happening, etc.

Please show me that with open-wheelers in AMS. F3s, F1s, etc.

Or, get the 95 Ferrari F1 in AMS and induce a bunch of wheelspin on the exit out of a tight-corner while your car still has a lot of steering angle put in then, while the oversteer angle is still going and in a static (oversteer angle neither decreasing nor increasing) sideways state, controllably modulate/adjust the wheelspin and slide angle, then floor the throttle while adding opposite lock to compensate and keep the throttle floored while the wheelspin slowly dies down on it's own as you leave huge strips of black rubber down the straight. I showed a good example of this in a 1996 F1 car a few pages back in this thread.

They CAN spin or worse but they don't have too. I've seen millions of videos of open-wheel cars getting floored while sideways...or, while sideways, they give a little lift of the throttle but just a bit while still keeping lots of wheelspin and oversteer angle and they can then manipulate/control the wheelspin and angle. This is common stuff throughout racing. I sometimes wonder if, short of really racing themselves (expensive and not common), if some people even watch racing and observe car behavior. It literally takes just a few minutes of watching an open-wheel practice session or race to see.

Also, then blaming it on lack of downforce is a logical fallacy. Yes, there's little to no downforce between 0 and what, 80 km/h give or take 20? Regardless, downforce adds outright grip (it adds the effect of more mass without the negative effects of more actual mass) but fundamental physics still apply regardless of outright grip. FIner characteristics will change depending on grip/downforce (just like characteristics change between different cars, tyres, setups, etc.) but the "bigger picture" doesn't change.

In real-life, when a vehicle's rear tyres are slipping and an oversteer situation is occurring, the car doesn't behave as if mass and weight suddenly stopped existing, or as if the tyres lost 99.9% of grip or contact with the road-surface, or as if the car suddenly gained 500% torque. Making a blanket statement like [paraphrasing] "a car has lots of power and is lightweight so it should automatically spin-out" is extremely misinforming and is just false.

It's the same arguments fans of "x" racing sim use. A car is super powerful so it should spin. Tyres are cold so the car should instantly spin. No/little downforce so car should instantly spin. These are all false and watching literally any car from any racing series from any decade "should" make this obvious to anyone.

There is already another thread with this same F3 video. Even Niels Heusinkveld replied to that one. No need to repeat the same replies as are there. Yes, AMS can replicate that behaviour is the simple answer.

 

[Marc Collins]

If lance stroll or johnny dumfries can get out of the pits with the rear tires smoking without an incident but the same thing is borderline impossible in sim you know something is not right. Spins in the pits in real life are incredibly rare considering during race pit stops it is sideways burnouts everytime a car leaves the pitbox.

Who spins leaving the pits in AMS? I am not aware that it is a common problem...

Of course you can do it if you want to.