'Hypercar' Regulations Confirmed to Replace LMP1 in 2020/21

[Isaac Chavira]

I hope they return to the old formula of GT3, GT2 and GT1 altogether. I can already see the following:

• McLaren 720 LT-R or 730 LT-R
• AMG GT-R or CLS-R
• Porsche 920-GTR
• Ferrari F70-GTR
• Lamborghini LP-GTR
• Mazda 788
• BMW M9-R
• Audi R9-GTR
• Acura or Honda ?????

Just my thoughts and I hope it all happens.

 

[Ben Lee]

This why nobody should get in bed with FIA. Hey lets build brand new LMP1 Cars from the ground up and make them worthless in 2 years. Hopefully this ends the IMSA/FIA cooperation on rules.

You only have to look at the hash they have made of the F1 regulations to see what a clusterf*** the FIA are.

 

[Richard Wilks]

The original idea was that Group C would use *old* F1 engines ( which sounds like dodgy wheeler-dealing already ) - only TWR did that deal with Cosworth, and so Peugeot & Toyota just had to do the same thing and there went any cost reduction. Strangling the older cars did not do anyone any favours, but honestly without a 962 replacement - I don't think even Spice were building customer cars although I vaguely remember one in IMSA - it'd have died anyway.

It wasn't TWR who spoiled Mr Bernie business of flogging his stock of DFVs to yet another series (like if F3000 wasn't enough). Peugeot turned up in 1990 with a screamer V10 full blown F1 engine first. The rest is history.

 

[James Egan]

So I'm picturing now an LMGTP spec LaFerrari, Valkyrie, P1 and GT. Dunno what Toyota would bring, maybe the new Supra? Anyway just overwhelmed with excitement as I typed that sentence.

GT1 cars were my childhood, to see something similar return, just so much yes.

918?

 

[NtsParadize]

So that means they will be much slower? F*ck this

 

[James Egan]

Should be workable with a couple of caveats.
1) Must have built and sold a minimum of 25 cars (50 would be better)
2) Any aerodynamic appendages must be homologated as per the production run.
3) Fuel must be set at a limited quantity (just like Gr.C)
That might do it.

What if they had to be road legal production cars to the spec of the homolegation ones?

 

[Damage Inc]

I'm cautiously happy, after all the genesis of endurance racing WAS road cars was it not? F1 are the ultimate prototypes, why try and copy. Get back to road cars being the basis of the racecars. Be nice to have more than 2 or 3 types of car at the top! or god forbid only one.....er

 

[ltcars]

Motorsport should be motorsport. Not "relevant". I think the time has gone where motorsport was a technology laboratory. Nowadays the technology found in road cars is higher than the one in lmp1 or f1. Cars have active suspension, moving aero, complex electronics controlling driver aids and engines, self driving cars... Race cars are just more expensive and there is massive massive difference in how the cars are used. Your car mostly sees a steady 60-80-100kmh driving or 0-50-0 stop and go city traffic. Race cars are driven flatout, braked at maximum tire limits, spend all their time accelerating and decelerating and taking corners fast. The two have very little in common and as such both are moving to totally different directions. Race cars and road cars are just as relevant to each other as wheel barrows and forklifts are.

I think it is killing motorsports how some people want just dump road car technology into race cars and acts like it will save the world. It makes no difference at all how much fuel 30 something race cars consume during a race. Having the fuel limits only hurts the show and makes the driving less exciting. The engine technologies that save fuel are researched and implemented in normal cars. Race cars are and should be built to go fast with optimal fuel strategies. Not save fuel or look green.

I fear if not the FIA will make these rules other institutes will intervene and force them to apply green rules. Like there are noise limits on race tracks so only cars with low enough pollution will be allowed to drive

 

[Richard Dastardly]

I'm cautiously happy, after all the genesis of endurance racing WAS road cars was it not? F1 are the ultimate prototypes, why try and copy. Get back to road cars being the basis of the racecars. Be nice to have more than 2 or 3 types of car at the top! or god forbid only one.....er

You'd have to put up with BoP if you want it production based, and GTE-Pro is showing just what a mess that is. For the genesis point - of course road cars were the origins of endurance racing, they're the origins of *every* racing car; that doesn't mean someone didn't take the guts of a road car and make a racing special out of it. Endurance racing isn't just about if the car can endure, it's if the entire team can endure.

Prototypes for a while have been defined as two seaters, F1 cars aren't prototypes in that sense. You'd have to be very friendly with a driver to get into the passenger side of a LMP, but it's technically possible.

Endurance racing has also been about testing new tech - the ACO really should still be pushing new propulsion tech ( and they're trying ) even if they stumbled a bit with LMP-H. Alternative propulsion doesn't have to mean battery-electric, there are plenty of biofuels. The concept of recovering otherwise wasted energy is also something that should really be applied everywhere; there's no reason to be wasteful. Burning energy in pursuit of speed is not wasteful in this sense, but burning energy in braking might well be.

Aren't all prototype race cars basically redundant after a season?

They aren't - a quick look at history shows they're generally around for quite a few years unless the rules make them illegal. They might not even be called the same thing, but prototypes are long lasting.

 

[Damage Inc]

You'd have to put up with BoP if you want it production based, and GTE-Pro is showing just what a mess that is. For the genesis point - of course road cars were the origins of endurance racing, they're the origins of *every* racing car; that doesn't mean someone didn't take the guts of a road car and make a racing special out of it. Endurance racing isn't just about if the car can endure, it's if the entire team can endure.

Prototypes for a while have been defined as two seaters, F1 cars aren't prototypes in that sense. You'd have to be very friendly with a driver to get into the passenger side of a LMP, but it's technically possible.

Endurance racing has also been about testing new tech - the ACO really should still be pushing new propulsion tech ( and they're trying ) even if they stumbled a bit with LMP-H. Alternative propulsion doesn't have to mean battery-electric, there are plenty of biofuels. The concept of recovering otherwise wasted energy is also something that should really be applied everywhere; there's no reason to be wasteful. Burning energy in pursuit of speed is not wasteful in this sense, but burning energy in braking might well be.

You know what I mean about origins, F1 cars were never road based from the beginning, always bespoke race cars. You're using the Endurance meaning of the term "prototype" I'm using it as the term to mean cars/vehicles that are bespoke and not based on anything production based (one offs). Like the difference between World Superbikes and Moto GP. I can go into a shop and buy a ZX10R similar(ish!) to Johnny Rae's, but short of some limited run one offs that Honda and Ducati have done I cannot buy a Moto GP bike.

Nothing really wrong with BOP as if done correctly ensure no one runs away with things (in theory of course). I'd rather that than just guess which of 1-2 or (gosh) 3 makes of car will win LMP1Hy.

 

[Tim Meuris]

Never been much into endurance racing but I like this news. These lmp's were the ugliest racecars I have ever seen

 

[Richard Dastardly]

You know what I mean about origins, F1 cars were never road based from the beginning, always bespoke race cars. You're using the Endurance meaning of the term "prototype" I'm using it as the term to mean cars/vehicles that are bespoke and not based on anything production based (one offs). Like the difference between World Superbikes and Moto GP. I can go into a shop and buy a ZX10R similar(ish!) to Johnny Rae's, but short of some limited run one offs that Honda and Ducati have done I cannot buy a Moto GP bike.

Nothing really wrong with BOP as if done correctly ensure no one runs away with things (in theory of course). I'd rather that than just guess which of 1-2 or (gosh) 3 makes of car will win LMP1Hy.

I could go back to the beginning & find specialist racecars, but even sticking to "since F1" you'll find specialist endurance cars. Back then you could throw a plate on them & drive them away, but you could probably do that to a F1 car in 1950 without much more than sticking lights onto it. Off the top of my head, let's pick... the Jaguar D-type ( 1954 ). Can register one for the road but it sure wasn't built as a road car, it's about as practical as using a modern Radical. It did bring aerospace construction to cars though - this is what prototypes are historically for. That's why LMP-H was there in the first place, it was just horribly conceived.

BoP is ok in theory for privateer events - in those cases the teams are competing & quite a few of them will have the same car, which is why Blancpain works ok. In GTE-Pro and anything with pure works teams it just makes the event a farce, because it's the cars competing; what's the point putting a major amount of work into building a car when you can do a bare minimum & get the regulations to equalise it all? you can gain more on the track by influencing the politics than by good engineering. Porsche have been past masters at playing games with the rule makers, but at least in times past they've also had to do the engineering, hence the 917 and the 911GT1. There'd be zero point in something like the 911 GT1 now, because it'd just get hammered by BoP to bring it down to the others.

My concern with the new prototype class is they're going to say "here's a budget, build it to look however you want, we'll BoP it all at the end". What's the point? that's as artificial as just picking the race results with the BoP computer.

 

[Damage Inc]

I could go back to the beginning & find specialist racecars, but even sticking to "since F1" you'll find specialist endurance cars. Back then you could throw a plate on them & drive them away, but you could probably do that to a F1 car in 1950 without much more than sticking lights onto it. Off the top of my head, let's pick... the Jaguar D-type ( 1954 ). Can register one for the road but it sure wasn't built as a road car, it's about as practical as using a modern Radical. It did bring aerospace construction to cars though - this is what prototypes are historically for. That's why LMP-H was there in the first place, it was just horribly conceived.

BoP is ok in theory for privateer events - in those cases the teams are competing & quite a few of them will have the same car, which is why Blancpain works ok. In GTE-Pro and anything with pure works teams it just makes the event a farce, because it's the cars competing; what's the point putting a major amount of work into building a car when you can do a bare minimum & get the regulations to equalise it all? you can gain more on the track by influencing the politics than by good engineering. Porsche have been past masters at playing games with the rule makers, but at least in times past they've also had to do the engineering, hence the 917 and the 911GT1. There'd be zero point in something like the 911 GT1 now, because it'd just get hammered by BoP to bring it down to the others.

My concern with the new prototype class is they're going to say "here's a budget, build it to look however you want, we'll BoP it all at the end". What's the point? that's as artificial as just picking the race results with the BoP computer.

hmmm I thought F1 had always been bespoke race cars!

I see your point, the problem with the "engineering" side of things that if someone does "too" good a job then it makes the races boring for a lot of people. I can see both sides to that, as a Kawasaki fan and seeing them finally gets a string of results in WSB only to have the rule makes constantly trying to cripple the Kwaka with rule changes it's a PITA. But the dominance of a team/make/rider/driver I don't have much affinity with is crap.

Didn't know BOP went so far as to bring a wide variance together, that is a bit crap, there should be a minimum lap time at a test track or something, so under that time and it's "so sorry you're a bit too crap" sort of thing.

 

[JayOTT]

BoP does however have the advantage of keeping costs down, at least in theory. Since the teams can't gain from excessive spending to make your car faster than everyone else, everyone saves a lot of money. Perhaps it's the reason why have six works teams contesting Le Mans in GTE Pro vs Toyota being the only works team left in LMP1.

Of course, there have been compelling arguments made in favour of removing BoP too, and we can't ignore the sandbagging allegations. But if the BoP were to be removed, great care would have to be taken to ensure the category remains affordable. Ultimately, any racing is better than no racing.

 

[JoelK]

Never been much into endurance racing but I like this news. These lmp's were the ugliest racecars I have ever seen

I strangely almost prefer the looks of them over for ex. F1's