read more: FFB Tweaks

I've worked with x4fab to add a new feature to the Custom Shaders Patch (as of 0.1.51) and the description is fairly brief so I thought it's worth going into a bit more detail about what this does.

7hNkrdT.png


Gyro Implementation

[ ] Active check to enable
Strength 25% adjust effect strength
AC has an "Experimental Gyro" FFB effect whose purpose was adding gyroscopic effects to the steering. It never lost the experimental tag and all it's generally recommended for is damping down oscillations on direct drive wheels.
This is that, developed slightly further based on my understanding of the nature of gyroscopic forces. I have a pretty solid case for making this change, and I believe this force exists in actual cars, and AC's original experimental gyro does not.

The developed version still suits the purpose of damping oscillations, but more importantly it decouples the body from the front wheels - so if the front wheels are pointing in a direction and the body moves around them, no gyroscopic precession happens, and no force is generated. Concretely, what we're talking about here is oversteer - on the original experimental gyro, the force acts counter to self-alignment during oversteer. With this new implementation, self-alignment is allowed to occur freely, or, if the oversteer is so quick that the wheels can't self-align, it'll actually push in the direction of alignment.

25% is simply equivalent to the original force multiplier used on experimental gyro when merging it with other FFB forces. Ultimately, the same as the other amplification ffb effects like road and slip effect, the slider is available to magnify it if your hardware's limitations are obscuring the effect.
As of CSP 0.1.53 the strength slider is outdated. A calculation using the suspension geometry now provides the right precession-based force for each car.
The description is a little bit misleading; this replaces "Experimental Gyro" so disabling it is superfluous, if this is Active, experimental gyro is not. Still, it won't hurt to disable experimental gyro and be certain it's off.

Now that I've said what the intent is, I will also note the following: this changes FFB in pretty much every dynamic situation. It's not just an improvement for drift cars or for vintage cars that oversteer constantly; any time the car moves around on the tires it feels slightly different from before. To me, it's a positive change, it's clearer what the car is doing, and I have heard similarly positive comments from testers. Nonetheless, I am not omniscient, I have not driven all these cars in real life, it's up to you to decide whether it improves your game or gives you better sim feeling the rubber or what. Modifying games to improve the FFB is a fine tradition starting with some extremely thorough efforts in rfactor1, and this is no different (maybe a bit easier to install).

I will note that it slightly increases max forces when cornering so if you have stuff set up to barely clip, you'll need an adjustment downward in global ffb mult.

Range Compression

Range compression 100% - 100% is the "default off" of this effect
[ ] Range compression assist - check to convert cars' "steer assist" into range compression.

New FFB Tweak available as of 0.1.53. The name comes from the audio world, where dynamic range compression means bringing up the quiet sounds while leaving loud sounds at their original volume. This is a much more second derivative friendly version of the Gamma effect.

The percentage is straightforward: Set it to how much you want to multiply small forces. Or adjust it in sync with your overall gain if you want to maintain the level of small forces and change large forces. For example, 200% compression + 50% gain = original 100% on small forces, larger forces decrease. If you're curious, the curve at the point of maximum force is simply the inverse, 200% compression will cause large forces 50% of the original delta in force. But in combination with 50% gain, you're moving the original maximum force downward and the ceiling before the game clips is much higher.

Think of this like power steering: you only want it to assist the heavy forces and give you maximum feel of the light forces.

This is very much an "adjust to taste" thing, it operates smoothly enough that you're safe running it upward of 300%, and I have seen IRL data indicating that manufacturers effectively go as high as 600% in power steering systems, when they want to bring 20+N forces down to a comfortable 2-3N.

Steer assist is a built in per-car feature of AC that applies a gamma function to that car's FFB. If you check Range compression assist, then FFB Tweaks will calculate an appropriate range compression adjustment, and disable steer assist. This should give you a far more normal FFB feeling (no weird bumps around center) while retaining the original goal of giving high downforce cars enough low-speed FFB to be drivable.
 
Last edited:
So Kunos made wrong cars and gyro to match. Interesting.
Yeah, almost all of their cars have some serious issue. They made 200+ cars, so there's about a week of time theoretically to make a car everything considered. In reality probably 2, 3 days because Aris has to do other things as well.

You don't have to believe me, I and others have went over a large part of them ourselves. Pick a random car from the list, find the workshop manual and compare the steering angles. If you're lucky and there's schematics and/or curves, compare those.

The CTR is, what was it, somewhere around 200 - 300% average off on the camber curves on the rear, and the front geo including caster, KPI, scrub radius etc. are off as hell. E30 rear also is screwed up, alongside steering geo. I've got curves for both of those, one from Porsche themselves and some owners, one with angles from BMW, but curves measured by someone else than BMW.

Another which is for sure off is the FD3S, for which I have the Japanese late-model manual with camber curves which I compared to...

No one I've ever said this to has ever believed me, because they've done a total of 0 hours, 0 minutes of actual sim physics dev, so of course they haven't seen it for themselves.
 
Yeah! I 100% agree!
Very nice feel. Best I ever remember AC driving.
I'm fighting an earlier problem I think has something to do with the way my CPU handles threading with this particular software? I think I'm going to try upgrading my motherboard, CPU and ram?
But with this FFB gyro and a few other tweets I can not believe the traction I have now. Now I understand what guys mean by saying AC having too much traction. The P1 for instance is on rails but I have never experienced a super car with slicks on optimum track conditions before so I imagine it would feel like too much traction? And this was a nonresponsive, ice sliding joke before.
 
Hi all. Why is everything so complicated? :( I think there are a lot of options and settings and I don't know now which combination is correct. Should I use LUT? Or should I use FFB clip app? What about "unlock experimental options" in CM? I spent 2 weeks with testing a lot of combinations of settings and I get good feeling and now we have again next option "FFB tweak". The shame is that i don't know how should feel FFB because i drived 3 cars in reality so I can't compare it. My whole testing and adjustments are just according feeling in game. Also I think 90% of peoples which want to play this game will not test 1000 combinations and read the forums and manuals to get best way. It should be like presets settings for each hardwares (wheels) with best realistic settings, tested and comfirmed by creators. When I bought my setup around 700 dolars, I would never say that this is like rocket science. If customer buy hardware and game, he should have already prepared...Just my opinion...
 
If you want the most basic realistic settings you do like this:
Gain: user preference for overall strength (I like 75% on my Thrustmaster T300, ymmv)
filter: 0%
minimum force: according to your hardware (0% for DD, 5% for most belt/gear wheels but you should look up specifics on this one. if it's something obscure, turn it up until the wheel rattles sitting still, then cut back a couple percent)
effects: 0% across the board
hardware lock: enabled if your controller is listed
post-processing disabled (no lut)
experimental options: meh, leave them off

csp ffb tweaks:
gyro active, strength 25%
gamma 100% (this is the 'do nothing' setting)



AC's still far ahead of the competition as far as number of sliders though... Project Cars lets you move about a dozen sliders related just to steering forces.
 
Last edited:
If you want the most basic realistic settings you do like this:
Gain: user preference for overall strength (I like 75% on my Thrustmaster T300, ymmv)
filter: 0%
minimum force: according to your hardware (0% for DD, 5% for most belt/gear wheels but you should look up specifics on this one. if it's something obscure, turn it up until the wheel rattles sitting still, then cut back a couple percent)
effects: 0% across the board
hardware lock: enabled if your controller is listed
post-processing disabled (no lut)
experimental options: meh, leave them off

csp ffb tweaks:
gyro active, strength 25%
gamma 100% (this is the 'do nothing' setting)



AC's still far ahead of the competition as far as number of sliders though... Project Cars lets you move about a dozen sliders related just to steering forces.

Thank you for reply. Btw what is the DD? I have G29 hardware. Do you have experience with this Wheel?
 
Thank you for reply. Btw what is the DD? I have G29 hardware. Do you have experience with this Wheel?
DD stands for Direct Drive wheels, in my experience with the g29 i recall using Rasmus' lut files with a few minor tweaks, you'll find a lot of helpful stuff on this thread:

I'd go for the recommended lut file, adjust your minimum force as stated above, keep experimental options on but AC gyro off, turn on Stereo's ffb tweaks module @ 25% and ditch all extra effects like slip abs etc. At least that's what worked for me on the g29, hope it does for you too, happy racing!
 
DD stands for Direct Drive wheels, in my experience with the g29 i recall using Rasmus' lut files with a few minor tweaks, you'll find a lot of helpful stuff on this thread:

I'd go for the recommended lut file, adjust your minimum force as stated above, keep experimental options on but AC gyro off, turn on Stereo's ffb tweaks module @ 25% and ditch all extra effects like slip abs etc. At least that's what worked for me on the g29, hope it does for you too, happy racing!

Thank you. Yes I saw rasmus settings also we had a personal converastion by chat. But when I used this linear LUT, I didn't like it because a lot of shaking with Wheel in low speed or during accelerate. I tried to generate my LUT by wheelcheck, and its seems to be better. Shaking was disappear and its seems to be more smooth in every cases/Speeds. I will try Stereo recommends and also your and I will see.
 
If you want the most basic realistic settings you do like this:
Gain: user preference for overall strength (I like 75% on my Thrustmaster T300, ymmv)
filter: 0%
minimum force: according to your hardware (0% for DD, 5% for most belt/gear wheels but you should look up specifics on this one. if it's something obscure, turn it up until the wheel rattles sitting still, then cut back a couple percent)
effects: 0% across the board
hardware lock: enabled if your controller is listed
post-processing disabled (no lut)
experimental options: meh, leave them off

csp ffb tweaks:
gyro active, strength 25%
gamma 100% (this is the 'do nothing' setting)



AC's still far ahead of the competition as far as number of sliders though... Project Cars lets you move about a dozen sliders related just to steering forces.

Hi. So I tested two types of settings. Your recommendation and Droplin with LUT. I am surprised that basic settings (no LUT) its better. I tried GT3 and also drift cars and BMW 235i and in all cases Wheel was more smooth. I think I will let it be like this but I have 2 questions: 1. Should I use FFB clip? 2. I am not sure how to set minimum force but I did test with "wheeltest" and I did here min force test and results was 10,5 so I set it like this.

I will upload photos with my settings:
1588892705871.png

1588892749396.png
 
Today's CSP update to 0.1.53 changes FFB Tweaks in a couple ways so I updated the original post.
Specific change log
- gyro effect strength is now based on the car's suspension geometry instead of a fixed 25%. For the most part this changes it downward; some cars like the E30 Drift with high caster actually go upward to roughly 30%. This is dynamic; changes with suspension travel or as you steer change the strength.
- gamma removed cause it was confusing (if you want gamma, AC has built in ffb post-processing gamma)
- range compression added, which is the "how I would do it" version of gamma. Still amplifies small forces, but uses a more intuitive slider (percent to increase small forces) and has far cleaner derivatives, to reduce perceived nonlinearity.
 
Today's CSP update to 0.1.53 changes FFB Tweaks in a couple ways so I updated the original post.
Specific change log
- gyro effect strength is now based on the car's suspension geometry instead of a fixed 25%. For the most part this changes it downward; some cars like the E30 Drift with high caster actually go upward to roughly 30%. This is dynamic; changes with suspension travel or as you steer change the strength.
- gamma removed cause it was confusing (if you want gamma, AC has built in ffb post-processing gamma)
- range compression added, which is the "how I would do it" version of gamma. Still amplifies small forces, but uses a more intuitive slider (percent to increase small forces) and has far cleaner derivatives, to reduce perceived nonlinearity.
What about range compression assist? should we enable it as well?
 
I think I would leave it turned off until you encounter a car that has the steer assist option in setup (sorry, don't know offhand how it looks, but it should be a general tab option) - I believe RSS F1 cars are among the ones that use it? Then you can do a before/after comparison.
 
I think I would leave it turned off until you encounter a car that has the steer assist option in setup (sorry, don't know offhand how it looks, but it should be a general tab option) - I believe RSS F1 cars are among the ones that use it? Then you can do a before/after comparison.
Thanks so much, rss f1 and gt cars do use it, and if I recall correctly some of Shaun Clarke's Ginettas do too. Will test the new tweaks later, thanks for the update, much appreciated!
 
Today's CSP update to 0.1.53 changes FFB Tweaks in a couple ways so I updated the original post.
Specific change log
- gyro effect strength is now based on the car's suspension geometry instead of a fixed 25%. For the most part this changes it downward; some cars like the E30 Drift with high caster actually go upward to roughly 30%. This is dynamic; changes with suspension travel or as you steer change the strength.
- gamma removed cause it was confusing (if you want gamma, AC has built in ffb post-processing gamma)
- range compression added, which is the "how I would do it" version of gamma. Still amplifies small forces, but uses a more intuitive slider (percent to increase small forces) and has far cleaner derivatives, to reduce perceived nonlinearity.

Looks nice. So how I should set it now? Strenght is still there (25%), should I set it to 0? Then switch to on range compression and set it to 100%?
 
Hello! I've tried setting up FFB tweak and it has turned off FFB at all. The wheel now acts like a cheapo non-FFB wheel - it always just tries to center itself. How can I fix that?

UPD
I figured it out - the problem was the drivers that did senpuku for some reason
 
Last edited:

Latest News

How are you going to watch 24 hours of Le Mans

  • On national tv

    Votes: 7 30.4%
  • Eurosport app/website

    Votes: 7 30.4%
  • WEC app/website

    Votes: 3 13.0%
  • Watch party

    Votes: 3 13.0%
  • At a friends house

    Votes: 1 4.3%
  • At Le Mans

    Votes: 2 8.7%
Back
Top