UFO Discussion

[Omer Said]

Left is the Sun, right is the Crescent.

About the former pictures; sorry but those "discs" as you name are so natural-looking. That rounded light-beam is coming from the God, a blessing. That land on the sky is looking like heaven. It's so obvious. You are pushing extremely hard to get some UFOs from those pictures, but when you look simply, they are definitely some common Christian themes painted by some goodly-imaginative artists...

 

[Hampus Andersson]

What if the conspiracy is that large nations produces these sightings, they have the means of faking radar data, organizing lavish setups and so on..

Yes because that makes perfect sense. Or not.

Ok i guess we will do this, wait. And if i´m right you know you will get a PM everyday saying i told you so
For now let´s agree to disagree, for me it´s obvious that it´s been covered up. For you, not so much.

For me videos is enough proof as CGI still has several years left to get even remotely close to reality.
It´s very easy to spot what is fake on youtube for example. Very easy.

 

[Hampus Andersson]

Left is the Sun, right is the Crescent.

About the former pictures; sorry but those "discs" as you name are so natural-looking. That rounded light-beam is coming from the God, a blessing. That land on the sky is looking like heaven. It's so obvious. You are pushing extremely hard to get some UFOs from those pictures, but when you look simply, they are definitely some common Christian themes painted by some goodly-imaginative artists...

The sun and the crescent contains humans or humanoid figures. Can´t say i ever heard that the bible talked about a little dude living in the sun.

That rounded disc in the sky is what? "natural looking"? Yes because 200 years ago natural discs appeared in the sky randomly.
the other one is now heaven... hmm i thought the first one was heaven?
Maybe Heaven changes shape from time to time? Frankly i thought nobody knew how heaven looked, not even the christians.

-
Just think about this for a second..

Almost every single religion in the world contains "sky-people".
Someone came from the sky and helped the people.
Or take certain archaeological places in the world. There´s one in Peru where the stones are cut so finely that we barely can do it today with laser cutters.
When you ask the the people they look at you as if you were stupid and say the "gods" built it.

It´s very easy to see as well what is clearly human made because often when there´s a certain temple built with extra-ordinary precision, you see another temple close by that looks like crap and obviously made by humans.

Pyramids, one is so exact and so precise but the rest of them are not. What i´m saying is that there´s a very clear difference in terms of how stuff was built that laid just a couple a hundred meters away from each other.

 

[Omer Said]

Hampus, those pictures are not painted from a sightseeing or by a painter witnessing a historical moment. They are imaginative, figurative and metaphorical. Lightbeam shining upon the holy man on land is a very common theme in religious paintings, yet you relate it to UFOs.

And that heaven in the sky... Can't you see it's a plane like "Neverland" of Peter Pan? There is a lake, mountains, grass... What can it be? Heaven is the only possible answer imo, in a religious painting.

Christianity borrowed much from the Greek mythology and even some from the Norse myths, and personazing planets is a very very common thing. There is also a "man on the moon" concept of Christianity. Artists are also mostly influenced from the Myths, so they used their figures and symbols usually.
-

Almost every single religion in the world contains "sky-people".
Someone came from the sky and helped the people.
Or take certain archaeological places in the world. There´s one in Peru where the stones are cut so finely that we barely can do it today with laser cutters.
When you ask the the people they look at you as if you were stupid and say the "gods" built it.

There might have been some highly advanced civilizations. Perhaps they knew a better technique? But also aliens also might done them too. As always, i say there is no certainity.

Also "Almost every single religion in the world contains "sky-people" " sentence is very strange. As for me, Islam has no men on the sky, and i don't know any other which has such a thing. There might be "sky-peoples" in those religions, but also they have "underground-people" too who are unholy or evil. So there are aliens underground too? If you mean the "Heaven" concept, then it is not in the sky, it's just above this universe, of course you would not put a concept of heaven underground...

 

[Hampus Andersson]

Hampus, those pictures are not painted from a sightseeing or by a painter witnessing a historical moment. They are imaginative, figurative and metaphorical. Lightbeam shining upon the holy man on land is a very common theme in religious paintings, yet you relate it to UFOs.

If it´s a common theme in religious paintings then provide three more examples showing discs in the sky.

And that heaven in the sky... Can't you see it's a plane like "Neverland" of Peter Pan? There is a lake, mountains, grass... What can it be? Heaven is the only possible answer imo, in a religious painting.

Can´t say i´ve heard anyone related heaven to being a physical world containing stuff from our world.
If there´s a lake, mountain and grass i´m pretty sure it´s earth.

There might have been some highly advanced civilizations. Perhaps they knew a better technique? But also aliens also might done them too. As always, i say there is no certainity.

Better technique then industrial laser cutters? Just take a step back and re-think that bit one more time.

Also "Almost every single religion in the world contains "sky-people" " sentence is very strange. As for me, Islam has no men on the sky, and i don't know any other which has such a thing.

You have Gabriel (Jibril) the angel who came with "holy" messages to muhammed.
Then in the bible Jesus is God. He came down to earth told everyone what to do etc.

There might be "sky-peoples" in those religions, but also they have "underground-people" too who are unholy or evil. So there are aliens underground too? If you mean the "Heaven" concept, then it is not in the sky, it's just above this universe, of course you would not put a concept of heaven underground...

You mean Ares and Satan?

None of which came to the people and told them what to do. God however did. Or Zeus.

It´s actually funny that you refer one to mythology while the other is religion. When in reality they are exactly the same.
One is a bit older and the other has a following that lives today.

 

[Omer Said]

Seeing we have very different point of views on many subjects, it's impossible to come to an agreement, that is why keeping this discussion is pointless. I can never make you accept my points, while you can't me neither. Nice to discuss tough

 

[Hampus Andersson]

Some fairly interesting quotes from people that you would not file as "rednecks" perhaps.

Dr. Hermann Oberth, who pioneered rocket design for the German Reich during World War II and later advanced rocket technology for the American manned space launches, cryptically stated:

“We cannot take the credit for our record advancement in certain scientific fields alone; we have been helped.”

When asked by whom, he replied:

“The people of other worlds.”

"In my mind, there is no question that they're out there. My Career is well established. My texts books are required reading in all the major capitals on planet earth. If you want to become a physist to learn about the unified feild therory-you read my books. Therefore, I'm in a position to say: Yes- Most likely they're out their, perhaps even visted, perhaps on our moon. - ABC News Quote --
-- Professor Michio Kaku Author of Theoretical Physics UNY

"I've been convinced for a long time that the flying saucers are real and interplanetary. Another words we are being watched by beings from outer space."
--Albert M. Chop, deputy public relations director, National Aeronautics and Space Administration,(NASA) and former United States Air Force spokesman for Project Blue Book.

"When the long awaited solution to the UFO problem comes, I believe that it will prove to be not merely the next small step in the march of science, but a mighty and totally unexpected quantum leap." "We had a job to do, whether right or wrong, to keep the public from getting excited"
--Dr.J Allen Hynek, Director US Air Force´s project Blue Book as a scientific consultant, astronomer, investigator and analysis.

"Of course it is possible that UFO's really do contain aliens as many people believe, and the Government is hushing it up."
--Professor Stephen Hawking

"Given the millions of billions of Earth-like planets, life elsewhere in the Universe without a doubt, does exist. In the vastness of the Universe we are not alone."
--The Bible According to Albert Einstein

"It is my thesis that flying saucers are real and that they are space ships from another solar system.There is no doubt in my mind that these objects are interplanetary craft of some sort. I and my colleagues are confident that they do not originate in our solar system."
--Dr. Herman Oberth (The father of modern rockerty)
"I am completely convinced that UFOs have an out-of-world basis."
--Dr. Walther Riedel (Once chief designer and research director at the German rocket center in Peenemunde)

"The possibility of reduced-time interstellar travel either by advanced extraterrestrial civilizations at present or ourselves in the future, is not fundamentally constrained by physical principles."
-- Dr. Harold Puthoff (Director, Institute for advanced studies at Austin, Author of fundamentals of Quantum Electronics)

The least improbable explanation is that these things are artificial and controlled ... My opinion for some time has been that they have an extraterrestrial origin."
--Dr. Maurice Biot (leading aerodynamicists and mathematical physicist)

"The evidence is overwhelming that Planet Earth is being visited by intelligently controlled extraterrestrial spacecraft. In other words, SOME UFOs are alien spacecraft. Most are not. It's clear from the Opinion Polls and my own experience, that indeed most people accept the notion that SOME UFOs are alien spacecraft. The greater the education, the MORE likely to accept this proposition"
-- Stanton Friedman Defense Contractor Nuclear Physicist

"Extraterrestrial contact is a real phenomenon. The Vatican is receiving much information about extraterrestrials and their contacts with humans from its Nuncios (embassies) in various countries, such as Mexico, Chile and Venezuela."
-- Monsignor Corrado Balducci As stated 5 different times on Italian TV** (Vatican theologian insider close to the Pope,Monsignor Balducci said that he is on a Vatican commission looking into extraterrestrial encounters, and how to cope with the emerging general realization of extraterrestrial contact.)

"We must insist upon full access to disks recovered. For instance, in the La case the Army grabbed it and would not let us have it for cursory examination."
--J Edgar Hoover

"I am convinced that these ojects do exist and that they are not manufactured by any nations on earth"
--Air Chief Marshal Lord Dowding (Commander-in-chief, Royal Air Force Fighter Command) (3) An outpouring of UFO reports which forces response in high places, particularly when unknowns virtually blitzed the U.S. capitol in Washington, D.C. An Air Force intelligence analysis also concluded that UFOs were interplanetary spaceships. (1952)

"The UFO phenomenon being reported is something real and not visionary or fictitious"
--General Nathan Twining Chairman, Joint chiefs of staff, 1955-1958

"With control of the universe at stake, a crash program is imperative.We produced the A-bomb, under the huge Manhattan Project, in an amazingly short time. The needs, the urgency today are even greater. The Air Force should end UFO secrecy, give the facts to scientists,the public, to Congress. Once the people realize the truth, they would back, even demand a crash program...for this is one race we dare not lose."
--Major Donald E Keyhoe USMC, Director NICAP 1953

"Unknown objects are operating under intelligent control... It is imperative that we learn where UFOs come from and what their purpose is. I can tell you, behind the scenes, high ranking military officers are soberly concerned about the UFOs"
--Admiral Roscoe Hillenkoetter (Former director of the Central Intelligence Agency)

"The possibility of reduced-time interstellar travel either by advanced extraterrestrial civilizations at present or ourselves in the future, is not fundamentally constrained by physical principles."
-- Dr. Harold Puthoff (Director, Institute for advanced studies at Austin, Author of fundamentals of Quantum Electronics)

An astonishing statement by Gen. Douglas MacArthur that, "...the next war will be an interplanetary war. The nations of the earth must someday make a common front against attack by people from other planets. The politics of the future will be cosmic, or interplanetary" (1955)

Truman climbs on board: "I can assure you that flying saucers, given that they exist, are not constructed by any power on earth"
--President Harry S. Truman

"The US Airforce assures me that UFO's pose no threat to National Security.."
--President John F Kennedy

I feel that the Air Force has not been giving out all the available information on the Unidentified Flying Objects. You cannot disregard so many unimpeachable sources."
-- John W. McCormack, Speaker of the House of Representatives of the United States. January (1965)

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Personal opinions, speculation, belief. Just like most of us, mathematically it almost a fact that there must be something out there. But nothing to really prove it.

 

[Hiroshi Awazu]

Lay out some Reeses Pieces out on your back yard tonight, see what happens Hey it worked for E.T

Sorry, had to throw that in

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

They are the Moon Nazis

 

[Hampus Andersson]

Personal opinions, speculation, belief. Just like most of us, mathematically it almost a fact that there must be something out there. But nothing to really prove it.

Not sure the first one would be classified as merely an opinion.


Neither would this one,

"All Apollo and Gemini flights were followed, both at a distance and sometimes also quite closely, by space vehicles of extraterrestrial origin - flying saucers, or UFOs, if you want to call them by that name.

Every time it occurred, the astronauts informed Mission Control, who then ordered absolute silence."

Maurice Chatelain
Former Chief of NASA Communications Systems

You can actually hear on several NASA radio traffic where they say stuff like Alien spacecraft etc.

 

[Hampus Andersson]

Some more,

"At no time, when the astronauts were in space were they alone: there was a constant surveillance by UFOs."

NASA Astronaut Scott Carpenter
Carpenter photographed a UFO while in orbit on May 24, 1962. NASA still has not released the photograph.

"Let there be no doubt. Alien technology harvested from the infamous saucer crash in Roswell, N.Mex., in July 1947 led directly to the development of the integrated circuit chip, laser and fibre optic technologies, particle beams, electromagnetic propulsion systems, depleted uranium projectiles, stealth capabilities, and many others.

How do I know? I was in charge!

I think the kids on this planet are wise to the truth, and I think we ought to give it to them. I think they deserve it."

Colonel Philip Corso
Former Head of Foreign Technology at the U.S. Army's Research and Development Department at the Pentagon. Four years Director of Intelligence on President Eisenhower's White House National Security Staff.

"I looked out the window and saw this white light. It was zigzagging around. I went up to the pilot and said, "Have you ever seen anything like that?" He was shocked and he said, "Nope." And I said to him: "Let's follow it!"

We followed it for several minutes. It was a bright white light. We followed it to Bakersfield, and all of a sudden to our utter amazement it went straight up into the heavens. When I got off the plane I told Nancy all about it."

Former US President Ronald Reagan
Describing his 1974 UFO encounter to veteran newsman Norman C. Miller, Washington bureau chief for the Wall Street Journal.

The best one, it´s so true.

"Something is going on in the skies that we do not understand.

If all the airline pilots and Air Force pilots who have seen UFOs - and sometimes chased them - have been the victims of hallucinations, then an awful lot of pilots should be taken off and forbidden to fly."

Captain Kervendal
French Gendarmerie

 

[Lee Knight]

My proof that there are NO aliens, is that we're still on planet Earth & haven't been enslaved so long ago that we have no memory of our origins....
After all, if they do exist & it was the other way around (we were the superior beings with the vastly higher level of technology), we'd have enslaved their arses by now!
It's just human nature, after all, look at whats happening to us here on our own planet....
Then again, if they DO exist & as we STILL haven't been enslaved, then maybe it's just like Red Dwarf's Lister once said on the subject; the aliens are sitting back & say "Earth, who'd wanna go near Earth, it's full of Humans- leave 'em alone & they'll wipe themselves out soon enough & we won't even need to kill 'em off!"
Actually, I think he referred to us as being the disease of the universe....

 

[Devil_Dog]

They do exist. I witnessed first hand last night their superior racing skills.

 

[Rupe Wilson]

I love the way these documentaries are put together....i makes it interesting even if you don't believe...

 

[Chronus]

Personal opinions, speculation, belief. Just like most of us, mathematically it almost a fact that there must be something out there. But nothing to really prove it.

Firstly, some of those quoted above are Physicists/Mathematicians, scientists. If it were you and a few others saying what these people said, yes, I would agree with you and label those opinions as "opinions, speculation, belief". But those quoted above are not like most of you and their fields of study has led them deeper than most of you in the understanding of the universe and reality.

Do not confuse your opinion and the value it has with the opinions of those quoted.

On the other hand...

As per our understanding of Physics today, our understanding of the Universe, it is not hard nor unsafe to say UFOs must be of terrestrial origin (some top secret weapons or aircraft operated by the US/Russians/British/whoever). Our science contradicts (apparently, at least) the extraterrestrial origin of these objects.

But right there lies the crux. Our current science and understanding of the universe. We cannot know what advanced civilizations might do, what their purposes would be, what means they have to traverse vast distances (from a mere 4 ly to dozens of parsecs) in a very short time (by means of wormhole physics or some other means).

As for the proof...

One thing is to be skeptic about these (although, how can any non-science oriented person be skeptic about something he/she understands almost zero...) objects and events, quite another is to ignore reports made public my several governments and government agencies throughout the world. Proof? There is proof that something inexplicable is happening or has happened or has been happening around the world. Even if we consider 5% of cases to be really inexplicable out of the thousands of observations/events, we get hundreds, if not thousands, of cases which defy science, technology and knowledge of the 20th and 21th centuries, which is why several scientists and reputable personalities demand the truth be told.

But hey...swallow whatever the mainstream media throws and pretend there are no governments/military/journalists/politicians stating UFOs are real.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

I'm not trying to make you lose your faith. There just ain't no credible proof available, no matter who states their opinion is just stating their opinion. There can be 100 scientist, soldiers, government officials, it really doesn't matter who they are, all saying they saw an ufo, all sane, no drugs but if they can't prove it, there is no proof. When the people stop talking and start showing, then there's hope that proof emerges but until then, there's no proof. Somethings out there, that's almost sure thing: we have include in to our equations the possibility that we are alone. Personally don't think so but no matter how minute the chance of it is, if there's a chance, it has to be taken in to consideration.. No matter how confused and propagandist the main stream media is, one thing is sure, until there is enough proof, they won't publish it. If there comes such an event that existence of alien life is absolutely proven, it would be impossible to keep it out of sight.

Most UFO nuts confuse proof and belief, facts and speculation so much that it's completely impossible to communicate with them. That is THE sole reason scientist aren't taking it seriously so blame your selves if your not trusted anywhere. A touch of humble pie and common sense, with a HUGE amount of skepticism and you are getting closer to your target.

 

[Hampus Andersson]

we have include in to our equations the possibility that we are alone.

No we don´t actually. It´s the exact opposite.
It´s a 100% certainty of life elsewhere mathematically speaking.

Estimated that around 10.000 civilizations exist in just our galaxy alone.
10.000!!!!

we have 190 something countries with MASSIVE differences in culture.
Imagine 10.000 civilizations all with their own culture and then perhaps countries on their planets.

 

[Chronus]

I'm not trying to make you lose your faith. There just ain't no credible proof available, no matter who states their opinion is just stating their opinion. There can be 100 scientist, soldiers, government officials, it really doesn't matter who they are, all saying they saw an ufo, all sane, no drugs but if they can't prove it, there is no proof.

Bud,

I make it a point to talk about things I know about. Subjects I know nothing about are off-limits - unless I inform myself or study them.

You are talking without knowing. Inform yourself, read the reports from the sources I mentioned. Read first, then talk.

Drugs are not needed (as you claim: "no drugs but if they can't prove it") - just read. Then talk.

Most UFO nuts confuse proof and belief, facts and speculation so much that it's completely impossible to communicate with them. That is THE sole reason scientist aren't taking it seriously so blame your selves if your not trusted anywhere. A touch of humble pie and common sense, with a HUGE amount of skepticism and you are getting closer to your target.

Again: in order for you to be skeptic about these events, you have to understand them (instead of relying on the usual debunker messed up, dishonest thinking). For you to understand what is happening, you have to critically examine what these people offer as "proof", instead of relying on hearsay, debunker posturing or mindless slogans.

And then you have to understand science. You have to know what, in science, contradicts these sightings/events/theories. But for you to understand science, you have to first study it, or a branch of it. Then you can safely talk about proof and belief.

The way you "talk" is oddly similar to all those..."special" people...who talk about creation, intelligent design and the lot. Belief first (via uninformed, pseudo-skepticism) and then some make-believe rational analysis of the subjects in front.

UFOs may or not not be real. UFOs may or may not be of extra-terrrestrial origin. But we must not allow people who gratuitously call others "nuts" be the ones to decide if UFOs are what some believe they are. Science and honest people have to step in and investigate this, otherwise those who research by proclamation will keep us from learning the truth.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

@Chronus : You obviously don't know me at all... I've read my share of these reports, those worth reading are very compelling reading and it's so nice to SPECULATE what might happened. If you had proof, you would show it to a scientist. It's not that scientist are refusing to read, it's that they don't understand what is happening and don't start to SPECULATE what might've happened and as they refuse to right out believe what this religion called UFO nuts says, they must be compromised, bribed, scared or in a conspiracy themselves. That is what is angering you, not that i refuse to stop believing cause that's all i can do since there are no proof. Still, no matter how much you try to twist this in to my ignorance and not having a fruitful conversation, the irrefutible fact is that there is no proof. Have i wrote that word down as many times as necessary? Nope, nothing can throw you off from your faith, just like good semi-religious people do. So get off your high horse and show me one, not 100, one good proof of what is happening. Not 3 hour ling video, not 50 pages of horrible sciencywordcombinations. No energylevels, no area 51, no weird crystals, something that is completely clear of any statements it can not prove to be true. Since there is thousands if not hundreds documents, pick one.