T300 motor upgrade. Need pinout info of original motor

[mattmisanthropy]

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Hi everyone,
I've purchased 5 motors for a few T300s I have. They're supposed to be an upgrade over the original T300 motors. The new motors in question are: 'BL4260 24v 4200rpm 32w'.
I had to disguise as a business and order samples because they normally only sell 1000 at a time.
Trouble is, the wires are all different colours (which I really should have expected).
The wires are also loose, so I need to connect the original motor's plugs on to them.
I've contacted the supplier and he's told me the pinout for the new motor. Now I just need the pinout for the original motor. Does anyone have this information?
I've also noticed the new motor doesn't have the magnet on the rear shaft. Will this new motor even work?
Pinout info for new motor is as follows:

When the red wire is connected to the positive pole of the power supply "+", and the black and blue wire connected to the negative pole of the power supply "-", the motor’s rotation direction is clockwise, viewed from the output shaft side.
When the red wire is connected to the positive pole of the power supply "+", and the black, blue and yellow wire connected to the negative pole of the power supply "-", the motor’s rotation direction is counter clockwise, viewed from the long output shaft side.
When the blue wire is connected to "-", the motor runs at full-speed.
When the blue wire is connected to the PWM signal, the motor speed can be adjusted.
When the white wire is connected to "-", the motor stops running .
The cable connection method of the motor must comply with the above instructions. Reverse connection of the positive and negative of the power is strictly forbidden. Do not connect the motor to voltage higher than 26.4 VDC.

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[mattmisanthropy]

Pleeeease someone help me with this

 

[GagarynGaribaldi]

What you are asking is very easy to determine by anybody with modicum of competence. Why go to all the hassle including fraudulently obtaining samples from a supplier when you clearly don't have the first clue how to do this?

 

[mattmisanthropy]

What you are asking is very easy to determine by anybody with modicum of competence. Why go to all the hassle including fraudulently obtaining samples from a supplier when you clearly don't have the first clue how to do this?

Jeez, I don't know mate. To save money? And don't belittle me to make yourself feel good for knowing something I don't. Either kindly offer help or bugger off. My skills don't lie in electronics - should that mean I give up on all attempts at diy and learning? What a ridiculous comment.
A better angle would have been to simply let me know how to determine the correct wires myself (if it's just so simple to you).

 

[Sithhy™]

Not to trump your hopes, but the motors you've got there will not work with the T300 for one main reason: no double-output shaft like on the original motor which means that you cannot connect the encoder to it, which is a very vital piece for the wheel to work correctly. Secondly, the motor specs don't even differ from the stock one at all, so if you were to somehow attach an encoder together with the magnet to one of them, you wouldn't feel any difference in how they operate; it could be slightly smoother in terms of rotation but that's it.

If you were to get a replacement motor with an encoder built-in (like the ChiHai BLDC4260), then there still would be no guarantee to it working properly as the number of cpr/ppr of the encoder might differ from the stock one, which could confuse the microcontroller on the mainboard in the wheelbase.

Sorry for the negative message, but I've been looking for a motor upgrade for my T300 for a few months now myself & the aforementioned ChiHai motor is the best bet thus far, but I don't know the exact specification of the stock encoder that is used in the T300, so in a way that motor is also ruled out temporarily. I've been wanting to get a B5665M-003 which is used in the TS-PC/TS-XW/T-GT but they seem to be pretty much impossible to find, where as their generic counterparts are all brushed which is a total no-go for this use.

 

[mattmisanthropy]

Not to trump your hopes, but the motors you've got there will not work with the T300 for one main reason: no double-output shaft like on the original motor which means that you cannot connect the encoder to it, which is a very vital piece for the wheel to work correctly. Secondly, the motor specs don't even differ from the stock one at all, so if you were to somehow attach an encoder together with the magnet to one of them, you wouldn't feel any difference in how they operate; it could be slightly smoother in terms of rotation but that's it.

If you were to get a replacement motor with an encoder built-in (like the ChiHai BLDC4260), then there still would be no guarantee to it working properly as the number of cpr/ppr of the encoder might differ from the stock one, which could confuse the microcontroller on the mainboard in the wheelbase.

Sorry for the negative message, but I've been looking for a motor upgrade for my T300 for a few months now myself & the aforementioned ChiHai motor is the best bet thus far, but I don't know the exact specification of the stock encoder that is used in the T300, so in a way that motor is also ruled out temporarily. I've been wanting to get a B5665M-003 which is used in the TS-PC/TS-XW/T-GT but they seem to be pretty much impossible to find, where as their generic counterparts are all brushed which is a total no-go for this use.

Thanks for the reply Sithhy. That wasn't negative at all, mate. What you say makes a lot of sense. After re-reading a post on Reddit that originally gave me this idea, they said you need to transfer over the magnet to the new motor. But yeah, as you say, my motors lack the double-output shafts, so I'll have to sell these on and continue my search.
What you say about no difference in performance though - I was under the impression that the original motors (B4260M 003)
were a 24W. From the Reddit post, he used a 32W B4260M-S02 and said he definitely noticed a difference in speed and power. Unfortunately, finding that same motor has been an issue.

 

[Sithhy™]

he used a 32W B4260M-S02 and said he definitely noticed a difference in speed and power.

I did see that post as well, but as I said, finding a suitable motor has been a pain, nevermind trying to get my hands on such a specific one. You could potentially experiment with the ChiHai motor I mentioned, but I'm not sure if anything will come out of it as well.

Also, was it said anywhere in your motors' offer if they come with an encoder built-in or not? When I wrote my original message it was 4AM so I wasn't thinking clearly, but now looking at the pictures, especially the last one, there seem to be 6 wires coming out of the motor instead of 2 or 3. I might retract my initial statement & say that these DO have an encoder built-in, but I doubt you know anything about its specification.

 

[mattmisanthropy]

I did see that post as well, but as I said, finding a suitable motor has been a pain, nevermind trying to get my hands on such a specific one. You could potentially experiment with the ChiHai motor I mentioned, but I'm not sure if anything will come out of it as well.

Also, was it said anywhere in your motors' offer if they come with an encoder built-in or not? When I wrote my original message it was 4AM so I wasn't thinking clearly, but now looking at the pictures, especially the last one, there seem to be 6 wires coming out of the motor instead of 2 or 3. I might retract my initial statement & say that these DO have an encoder built-in, but I doubt you know anything about its specification.

Yeah, I'm not sure what my plan is now. I'd bought a decent amount sim wheels from someone for a good price (8 T300 GT RS' and 2 TXs), of which, half work. I'd hoped to repair the non working ones, then sell them all (keeping one for myself). It was a way of getting a free T300 and making a little money. I think I'll just sit on these for now though until someone finds a motor that will definitely work before continuing. The motors didn't cost me too much and I should be able to sell them on anyway.

Here are the specs of the motors I'd bought:

◦Size: φ42.0* 60.0mm
◦Built-in driver
◦PWM pulse wide speed range
◦Clockwise/counter-clockwise rotation
◦FG speed feedback signal
◦Brake control
◦Low EMC
◦Low noise
◦High efficiency
◦Long life: 20000hrs Min.
◦Over-current protection
◦Over-voltage protection
◦Under-voltage protection

 

[Sithhy™]

I think I'll just sit on these for now though until someone finds a motor that will definitely work before continuing.

If you're willing to, you could try out one of those motors you bought. It won't destroy any of the electronics or electrical components but you could always find out that they work as well.

The only issue is that you would need to find out which wire to connect to which wire, because 6 of them is definitely not just for the motor but rather a built-in encoder as well. Sadly, I can't help you with that, but you might be able to colour-match the wires or something. Would be cool if you got it to work as it might be helpful for other people in the future

 

[Neilski]

The only issue is that you would need to find out which wire to connect to which wire, because 6 of them is definitely not just for the motor but rather a built-in encoder as well.

I did a spot of googling, because I was curious to know what the wires are for (and then cross-checked it against the info above). The extra four wires are not for an encoder, but instead frequency (as an output), direction, pwm (speed control) and brake.

 

[Sithhy™]

The extra four wires are not for an encoder

Ah, well, I feel dumb now I wasn't 100% sure myself if it was an encoder or something else, but I guess now we will know... However, one thing that this made me think of, is if the replacement motor I mentioned messages earlier (ChiHai BLDC4260) has an encoder built-in or not. It seems to be a direct replacement for the stock motor in the T300 yet it lacks a double-output shaft which means you can't mount an encoder to it the "original" way. I wasn't able to find any info regarding this, so I guess I will have to send an email to the company itself to find out.

 

[GagarynGaribaldi]

The first post in this thread explains the wiring and makes it clear that it is a simple motor with PWM control. ChiHai BLDC4260 is the same.

 

[Sithhy™]

ChiHai BLDC4260 is the same.

You are right, it is just a PWM control board. However, ChiHai seem to have the same motor but in a version with the encoder actually built in. It says in the description that it is for "game racing wheel", which means it could possibly fit the T300 just fine but I'm not sure how many ppr/cpr does the stock T300 encoder have. I've seen the number '16' thrown around somewhere but again, not 100% sure about it.

 

[GagarynGaribaldi]

You are right, it is just a PWM control board. However, ChiHai seem to have the same motor but in a version with the encoder actually built in. It says in the description that it is for "game racing wheel", which means it could possibly fit the T300 just fine but I'm not sure how many ppr/cpr does the stock T300 encoder have. I've seen the number '16' thrown around somewhere but again, not 100% sure about it.

No. It has FG output so can be linked to an encoder - as do all of the motors mentioned in this thread.

 

[Neilski]

It has FG output so can be linked to an encoder

What's the connection between an FG output and an encoder? I can't think how FG would help...

 

[GagarynGaribaldi]

What's the connection between an FG output and an encoder? I can't think how FG would help...

This thread seems to be referring to control board and encoder interchangeably.

 

[Sithhy™]

No. It has FG output so can be linked to an encoder - as do all of the motors mentioned in this thread.

Why would the motor need to have a built-in control board that needs to be linked to an encoder? Wouldn't all the rotation detecting be done by an external encoder, like a Hall-effect sensor anyway?

 

[GagarynGaribaldi]

Why would the motor need to have a built-in control board that needs to be linked to an encoder? Wouldn't all the rotation detecting be done by an external encoder, like a Hall-effect sensor anyway?

The motor doesn't have built in control board or encoder. It was you that said this was required, not me. We are going around in circles.

 

[Sithhy™]

We are going around in circles.

Oh well, I guess I confused everyone in here, including myself... Anyway, what do you think of this? The other ChiHai motor I linked in my message above does state it coming with an integrated Hall-effect sensor. Would that need any other controllers or would it be just "plug & play"?

 

[blekenbleu]

an integrated Hall-effect sensor

A Hall-effect sensor is used to make a motor brushless. Instead of brushes and a commutator, the Hall effect sensor detects when to electronically switch motor electromagnetic poles.