Should I worry?

[Martin Vindis]

We're now at the point where we're counting the hours until release of AMS2 and I haven't for second had any doubts that it will be great sim... until now.

Judging from AMS1, Reiza is the best sim/game developer in my book. They over delivered on every track, every car, every patch and every DLC, something I can't say about any other developer and I'm not speaking about our small niche sim group, I talking about the the entire game industry.
I've look forward to this day ever since AMS2 was first mentioned (or Reiza17(?) as it was called back then) and when they announced that they would going with the madness engine I was one of those who just smiled and thought "sure pc2 isn't what I'm looking for at all, but it's Reiza, they've got this, no worries".

But now, after watching some videos and listened to people talking about it, I'm not so sure any more. Youtubers I often share sim racing related opinions with and trust doesn't seems too happy with the game and I can tell from the videos that there is something strange going on with the cars, like there is some PC2 DNA in the physics department that quite a few people aren't too fond about.

I will still get AMS2 if for no other reason just to support Reiza. But I'm wondering if anyone else out there is a bit worried what we will be greeted by in a few hours? And is there someone out there who can calm us down, hold us tight and tell us that everything is going to be ok?

 

[Shovas]

Make sure you're watching videos from beta4+ plus (it's at like beta8 now) where some serious improvements occurred to FFB and later betas improved AI.

Physics shouldn't be an issue from what I'm seeing.

Also remember how much Reiza supports their product and just keeps improving and adding content.

They have 2 years planned and you better believe it'll be solid extra content, not fluff. Reiza has proven that.

Reiza, perhaps even more than Kunos, has proven their commitment to a product and to its ongoing improvement.

 

[Ghoults]

There seems to be people who are blindly in love with the game, some with preservations. Personally I'd be asking refund at this stage but I made my pre-order already back in 2015 so I don't think it is fair at all for me to even mention such things but I'd guess it tells how I feel about it so far. And I don't really mind waiting a year to see if the issues get fixed either.

I'd guess my main issue with ams2 is the huge number of bugs, annouyances and quirky physics and other oddities. At times I find myself picking a car and track and just hotlapping half a hundred laps just enjoy driving those tracks and cars you never see anywhere else. Having lots of fun. One more lap turns into one more tank of fuel. Other times I try online which just makes me sad.

Other times the car just drives too weirdly. Quirky. Lots of things are hit or miss.There are tons of basic usability issues and some really basic settings are missing or wrong. I won't go into specifics because the specifics can and I hope in most cases will change.

 

[polo199]

I would do the same as @Ghoults but my reasons would be opposite to his.

I'm quite OK with the current state of the game as a finished product. Nowadays, that's (unfortunately) the name of the game. Lots of EA's, games being complete/significantly different 1 year from their v1.0 release day, etc. AMS2 in its current state looks polished when compared to other sims (ACC in V1.0, rf2 still lacking a proper "modern" interface...). One would say it's even packed with features and content for a v1.0.

However, I'm kind of worried and, right now, even disappointed. FFB and physics, the global "tactile" feel of the game is not clicking with me. I'm not connected to the cars as I am in AMS1.
I'm worried because having subscribed to EA (as I had for AMS1) and having access to Reiza's beta forum, some clues make me think I might not ever "click" with AMS2. Not sure why. Currently, it's FFB and physics. And these are the main points for me in a sim. They're paramount to having fun and AMS1 delivered way above what I was expecting in that regard (and it kept on delivering till v1.5x).
I'm a bit worried because I think this feeling is coming from the physics and FFB engines and Reiza is not going to re-code everything.
Right now, I have 30-45 minutes at each AMS2 beta stage, I get a "meh-yeah, that's OK" feeling and I go back to AMS1. I load any car on any track (including the very best mods) and I get instant fun and giggles.

Voila. From an AMS believer and a Reiza fanboy (since GSCE)... or AMS fanboy and Reiza believer. I don't know.

 

[Miguel Batista]

I would do the same as @Ghoults but my reasons would be opposite to his.

I'm quite OK with the current state of the game as a finished product. Nowadays, that's (unfortunately) the name of the game. Lots of EA's, games being complete/significantly different 1 year from their v1.0 release day, etc. AMS2 in its current state looks polished when compared to other sims (ACC in V1.0, rf2 still lacking a proper "modern" interface...). One would say it's even packed with features and content for a v1.0.

However, I'm kind of worried and, right now, even disappointed. FFB and physics, the global "tactile" feel of the game is not clicking with me. I'm not connected to the cars as I am in AMS1.
I'm worried because having subscribed to EA (as I had for AMS1) and having access to Reiza's beta forum, some clues make me think I might not ever "click" with AMS2. Not sure why. Currently, it's FFB and physics. And these are the main points for me in a sim. They're paramount to having fun and AMS1 delivered way above what I was expecting in that regard (and it kept on delivering till v1.5x).
I'm a bit worried because I think this feeling is coming from the physics and FFB engines and Reiza is not going to re-code everything.
Right now, I have 30-45 minutes at each AMS2 beta stage, I get a "meh-yeah, that's OK" feeling and I go back to AMS1. I load any car on any track (including the very best mods) and I get instant fun and giggles.

Voila. From an AMS believer and a Reiza fanboy (since GSCE)... or AMS fanboy and Reiza believer. I don't know.

Have you balanced lfb and gain properly? I think once properly dialled in this games feels like AMS+

It feels like AMS but more nuanced and better.

 

[pennywiseguy]

Have you balanced lfb and gain properly? I think once properly dialled in this games feels like AMS+

It feels like AMS but more nuanced and better.

I'm running T300 with CSL pedals and didn't change anything from default FFB and it feels great, nearly the same as AMS1, maybe slightly less feel for the rear, but front end grip feel is amazing and I would say better than AMS1. My only worry is the AI, but each beta has improved them and in current state is easily acceptable. Problem is AMS1 raised the bar so high for our expectations of AI.

Compared to PC2, AMS2 beta laughs in the face of PC2 and happily holds hands with AMS1.

Remember, this is a beta/EA.

 

[polo199]

Have you balanced lfb and gain properly? I think once properly dialled in this games feels like AMS+

It feels like AMS but more nuanced and better.

Yes I have fiddle with them a bit. I recognize there has been some improvement since beta1. However, I'm still not getting the same global intuitive feel as AMS1. Turn-in especially I would say.
I don't agree with your AMS+ feeling. To me it feels different. More details on the tire contact patch but less intuitive and communicative when it comes to the global, what-my-car's-doing feeling, which was AMS1 main strength.

Also, I saw some posts about setting the FFB on different wheel brands some weeks ago. Not seeing these anymore.
To me it seems we're seeing way more "FFB settings???" posts in AMS2 forums than "GT3??? Nordschleife???" for AMS1's.

 

[Miguel Batista]

Yes I have fiddle with them a bit. I recognize there has been some improvement since beta1. I'm still not getting the same global intuitive feel as AMS1. Turn-in especially I would say.
I don't agree with your AMS+ feeling. To me it feels different. More details on the tire contact patch but less intuitive and communicative when it comes to the global, what-my-car's-doing feeling, which was AMS1 main strength.

Also, I saw some posts about setting the FFB on different wheel brands some weeks ago. Not seeing these anymore.
To me it seems we're seeing way more "FFB settings???" posts in AMS2 forums than "GT3??? Nordschleife???" for AMS1's.

Well, it is not even out for Early Access yet. I found I had to fiddle with FFB quite a bit and I still want to mess around with it more. In my CSW I have gain at 70 or 75, FX at 20 and LBF changes quite a bit depending on how the car is feeling. I haven't found a global setting yet but to me, driving back to back with AMS 1, I can generally tell what the car is doing better. The Stock car and the Formula 3 and the V12 are prime examples of this imho.

 

[Martin Vindis]

Make sure you're watching videos from beta4+ plus (it's at like beta8 now) where some serious improvements occurred to FFB and later betas improved AI.

No matter if I'm watching beta 1 or beta 7 videos something still looks off to me

Other times the car just drives too weirdly. Quirky.

This is what I've been seeing and hearing from other people and this is what worries me. There is nothing quirky about AMS1, cars behave, feel and sound as you'd expect them to and I was hoping this would carry over to AMS2.

Right now, I have 30-45 minutes at each AMS2 beta stage, I get a "meh-yeah, that's OK" feeling and I go back to AMS1. I load any car on any track (including the very best mods) and I get instant fun and giggles.

I'm not liking this at all. I don't want, as you describe it it, a "meh-yeah" feeling out of this. I'm not in need of another sim as I got RF2, AMS and ACC now that I play frequently but I'm always open for something to come around and blow my mind. Just like AMS1 and ACC (after some major updates mind you) did.

 

[FRSSNIT]

I have less experience the most of you I'm sure, but since 2018 I've entered the fanatec gear level and now with my CSW v2.5, and in Beta 9 I guess pre-release - early access I can kind of sympathise with some of the comments.

I will try to be specific, but bare in mind this is Beta-early access for now, and it has improved a lot since beta1. I will try to criticise/offer some subjective viewpoint on what can be improved, but I wanna make clear I put almost 60hours in this beta and I love it! I have been changing FFB and graphs in VR almost daily. I think there is room to improve always and it is coming:

For me, compared to AC, the front tires are missing or when you hit the kerbs you are left expecting the contact that eventually comes but not quite as you would expect.
My impression some times is that you get more sound than feeling as you learned to experience from other sims.
Raceroom you see a type of kerb and you know what is coming, you drive over it and there it is, AC for me also does that very well with different types of kerbs too.

Drifting and understeer were also a point of bother for me, way better at this time (Beta9) but again, I feel I have more sound than ffb or they are not quite matching.

To me AMS2 It is nothing like PC2, I tried my best with all ffb and mods to improve the ffb and I ended up uninstalling PC2 out of frustration.

I recommend you try for yourself, and I'm confident you will find yourself pleasantly surprised and since there's so much working ongoing for at least the next 2 years it can only get better!

 

[SwaggerJacker]

No matter if I'm watching beta 1 or beta 7 videos something still looks off to me


This is what I've been seeing and hearing from other people and this is what worries me. There is nothing quirky about AMS1, cars behave, feel and sound as you'd expect them to and I was hoping this would carry over to AMS2.

I'm not liking this at all. I don't want, as you describe it it, a "meh-yeah" feeling out of this. I'm not in need of another sim as I got RF2, AMS and ACC now that I play frequently but I'm always open for something to come around and blow my mind. Just like AMS1 and ACC (after some major updates mind you) did.

SInce you have no need for a real sim, wait. No one is going to coddle you here. Well I would hope not. Either buy it, or wait. As a last resort, wait till 1.0, buy it, refund if it doesn't give you the warm fuzzies you're looking for. If you are undecided after watching videos, no one here is going to change your view. A grip of Beta backers have said it does not drive like PC2. It is a WIP. Again, wait for 1.0.

 

[Martin Vindis]

Either buy it, or wait.

Well yeah, I'm well aware of my options here. There is no third option where I can half buy the game.

If you are undecided after watching videos, no one here is going to change your view.

Now that's a very pessimistic opinion you got there good sir.
People have changed my view many times on many things in the past and I can assure you that it will happen again.

 

[Miguel Batista]

Well yeah, I'm well aware of my options here. There is no third option where I can half buy the game.

Now that's a very pessimistic opinion you got there good sir.
People have changed my view many times on many things in the past and I can assure you that it will happen again.

With the abundance of info available in this forum, you should have enough info.

 

[Martin Vindis]

With the abundance of info available in this forum, you should have enough info.

Couldn't find a thread about beta 7-8, only a thread for beta 4-5 which is no longer relevant.

 

[John-Eric Saxén]

No matter if I'm watching beta 1 or beta 7 videos something still looks off to me

My honest opinion is, judging physics from watching videos is nonsense.

My advice would be approach it by being completely agnostic about the "pCars 2 DNA" talk, just drive and see if you notice any oddities, if so then fair enough. The rF1 engine used as base for AMS 1 isn't very sophisticated in today's terms and comes with compromises as well, it was designed to run on a single core Pentium 4. People keep saying AMS 1 physics are the best thing ever, yet they are based on a very aged and primitive tire model. Now we have a game that uses SMS engine, which also has its heritage in ISI engine despite what Ian Bell says, but it has also been developed with less restrictions from 10 years newer hardware. Anyway, the history behind the engine is frankly not very relevant as long as it outputs correct results.

 

[Martin Vindis]

My honest opinion is, judging physics from watching videos is nonsense.

It's not the best, I agree. But I still think you can see if anything is really off even from a video.

Anyway, after playing AMS2 for a few hours now I have mixed feelings about the game.
While the Stock Car V8 feels really good imo, the Formula V12, Formula Ultimate, Ultima and a couple of other cars I tried feels way off.
The good thing is that the Stock Car V8 shows me that it can be done in this engine so I guess it's all down to putting the right numbers in the physics files for the cars.

In Reiza we trust!

 

[Jriv012]

The day I drove AMS for the first time, I felt something so special that I connected with my friends right away, to tell them, you gotta get it!

Not tonight, sorry, I'm sure it will improve and la la la, will play it, for sure, let's give it time, but for sure not love at first sight...

 

[taylajee]

Of course it won't be that "something special". It is an evolution over AMS FFB imo, AMS2 feels generally slightly better to me. Physics wise, it is better lads. I think we should agree that the game is using a far more advanced physical modelling than AMS1, which probably contributes to the better feeling in my case. I had a lot of doubts too, during BETA1 and 2, but now... this is a good evolution over AMS1. AMS2 was not going to blow AMS1 out of water. AMS1 set the bar very high. AMS2 can only evolve from AMS1.